Fire Walk with Me — August 28, 1992–December 31, 1992

In article <1992Sep13.202953.28563@cco.caltech.edu> UnoJ writes:
> >Very puzzling is the dichotomy shown towards the ring by two of
> >the actors who are supposedly helping Laura: Coop warns her not to
> >take it (perhaps he thinks that she is not ready for it yet) but
> >the OAM tosses it to her and off she goes on her raod to salvation.

My interpretation of this is that Coop, perhaps due to simple lack of
knowledge, perhaps due to insufficient spiritual advancement, is
only trying to protect Laura's body - to prevent her physical death -
while the OAM/MIKE, understanding the much higher stakes involved, is
trying to protect her soul (even at the cost of her life).
-- -larryy@apple.com "Shi Nou Kou Sho Inu Neko Programmer" - Takada Naoki

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A couple of thoughts. First, let's face it, the kid tells BOB to
'Fell a victim.' Nice tree reference, but bottom line is, 'Hey
BOB, kill us another one.' Not a nice guy.

Second. It has been noted that various viewers have pined for
their favorite characters from the series to be in the movie.
Okay, time constraints accound for some of this, but let's
think about this for a second. As endearing, humorous and fun
as some (and I mean some) of these people are, the fact is
that Ben Horne, Catherine, Josie, Pete, Lucy, Andy, etc. really
amount to one or more of (a) comic relief, (b) two dimensional
foils, (c) soap opera as filler between segments of the real
story. Let's face it, most of this stuff was nothing more than
a show within the show, little more in depth than 'Invitation
to Love.' In fact, my heretical theory: these are Frost
characters, not Lynch characters. 

I say this as one who appreciates the whole fabric of the
show, including the look-and-feel these people provide, so
don't take me too seriously.

T

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In article <1992Sep15.042511.27712@cco.caltech.edu> UnoJ writes:
> >In article <15441@umd5.umd.edu> jblum@hamlet.umd.edu (Hi ho -- Kermit the Frog
> >here...) writes:
>> >>[editing the flick for focus...]

> >Now now.. I heartily disagree here. The first half (? I thought it was
> >a little longer than that) was brilliant.

...

[re the Laura bits]

> >I disagree again. This is a part of the movie I would have shortened.

> >You seem to have preferred the "let's really tie all those little
> >threads together" approach. The way it was was just fine for me
> >thank you. Sure, I would have made minor changes here and there,
> >but I was satisfied. It opened up another set of totally unexpected
> >questions and discussion possibilities. Just what the show at
> >its best was all about.

Agreed on that.  The problem was, the movie was trying to tell two
stories at once -- the what-the-hell-is-going-on-here mystery behind
Twin Peaks, and the personal story of Laura Palmer.

> >Concluding remarks: I have noticed that most people who griped
> >most vociferously about the movie had a whole set of expectations
> >before they entered the theater. I'm not trying to say that it's
> >a bad thing, I just trying to say that rarely have I liked a 
> >movie where I expected it to be exactly the way I envisioned it.

> >When I walked in I just had this in mind: "Mr. Lynch, wash the
> >TP world and mystery over me again...make me gasp in disbelief"
> >And for me, that happened many a time throughout both my viewings.

It seems like you had expectations of your own, though.  You expected
another episode of Twin Peaks: The Series, building more onto the mysteries
established in hour after hour of television.

If I had any expectations, it was that I would get to see a film by
David Lynch.  Nothing more.  It would have the powerful storytelling
of "Blue Velvet" and the weird somehow-it-all-hangs-together logic
of "Eraserhead", two absolutely fabulous films.

What I saw left me moved -- devastated, even.  My girlfriend and I walked
out of the theater at the end holding tightly onto each other... and
that was the second time I saw it, so I knew what was coming and it still
hit me hard.  I loved this film.

But it was not a perfect movie.

A perfect movie would not have garnered the reactions from the non-fans
who sat behind me at the first showing.  They snickered and laughed at
all the wrong moments -- every time the LMFAP said anything incomprehensible.
They fidgeted through the first half-hour of the film, giggled at the
white horse, and made vague "what the hell is this" noises at the sight
of Lil the dancing girl.

When Blue Velvet came out, I saw it with a bunch of friends who were in
that kind of a mood, and the film gripped even us by the throat and forced us
to listen to what it said.  We had known nothing about Lumberton or David
Lynch, and the film still grabbed us.

That's powerful filmmaking.

Twin Peaks: Fire Walk With Me had the potential to do that to audiences.
Some of the scenes -- Laura with James at the end, and BOB at Laura's
bookcase -- were the kind of moments that movies live for.  But there
was still too much stuff that lessened the intensity.

Now, as a Peaks fan, I liked the first half-hour of the film.  In fact,
I would have loved to have seen it explored in much greater depth, as a
separate movie.  A film made strictly with the fannish audience in mind,
with the somewhat lighter touch of the series.

But piggybacked onto the story of Laura Palmer, it lessened the impact
of what is a truly universal story.  The story of a woman coming to
terms with her life and her death.  A story which, if allowed to play
out without distractions, would have silenced even the most carping of
critics. 

Twin Peaks itself is simply too big a story to fit into two hours.  It's
like the awful movies they've made of Homer's Odyssey: either adventures
are left out entirely, or they are whittled down to incomprehensible
passing moments.  I think neither Laura's story nor Teresa's deserves
that fate.

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In article <1992Sep18.013201.840@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> ploux@nyx.cs.du.edu (Paul Loux) writes:
> >A couple of thoughts. First, let's face it, the kid tells BOB to
> >'Fell a victim.' Nice tree reference, but bottom line is, 'Hey
> >BOB, kill us another one.' Not a nice guy.

Funny, I thought that was "fell" as past tense.  As in, a victim fell.
He might have been talking about Teresa, or about Laura, considering
that time seems to be running backwards.

> >Second. It has been noted that various viewers have pined for
> >their favorite characters from the series to be in the movie.
> >Okay, time constraints accound for some of this, but let's
> >think about this for a second. As endearing, humorous and fun
> >as some (and I mean some) of these people are, the fact is
> >that Ben Horne, Catherine, Josie, Pete, Lucy, Andy, etc. really
> >amount to one or more of (a) comic relief, (b) two dimensional
> >foils, (c) soap opera as filler between segments of the real
> >story. Let's face it, most of this stuff was nothing more than
> >a show within the show, little more in depth than 'Invitation
> >to Love.' In fact, my heretical theory: these are Frost
> >characters, not Lynch characters. 

This is probably the first time I've heard Josie Packard, one of the
most complex characters on the show, dismissed as filler or two-dimensional.
Or Ben, who was pretty involved in the Laura Palmer plot from the word
go.

I would reject most of your examples of "filler", except maybe for Lucy
and Andy in the second half of the second season.  But I would definitely
agree that there was a lot of filler in the show.  The Milfords, little
Nicky (remember him?  Jeez, until this post I'd repressed all my memories),
Norma's mom, et cetera were IMHO completely irrelevant and tacked on.

...and (look what happend the last time I said this...) if I were God, or at
least a producer, their appearances in the series would have premiered
on the cutting-room floor.

However, you can't blame Mark Frost for all these characters.  By the point
most of the filler was introduced, neither Mark nor David was reportedly
very involved in production.


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In the last scene of the final episode, Cooper asks how Annie is.  I
paid particularly close attention this time; Coop turns to Harry when he
asks the question; Harry says she is fine, she is in hospital.  Harry
looks hesitantly at Doc Hayward, who in turn lowers his eyes and bends
his head down-covering his expression from Cooper.

The reactions of both Harry and the Doc point toward anything but good
news concerning Annie.  And remember Harry made several attempts to stir
Annie in the Grove of Sycamore trees - one attempt brought Cooper
around; Annie didn't respond at all.

It really looks to me as if Annie is dead.  I use this isolated fact to
ground my understand of many of the subsequent events in the Movie and
many of the implications of the series.  Does anyone have any reason to
strongly disagree with my claim (and reasoning as to why she might be
dead)?

Peter


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I remember hearing that Lynch was in a film just as an actor.
What was that film? Is it on video? What was it like?
(I remember hearing this around two years ago.)
-- Robert Chao Oakland, California

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In article <Bur5vx.LD0@well.sf.ca.us> rchao@well.sf.ca.us (Robert Chao) writes:
> >
> >I remember hearing that Lynch was in a film just as an actor.
> >What was that film? Is it on video? What was it like?
> >(I remember hearing this around two years ago.)
> >-- 
> >Robert Chao
> >Oakland, California


I am not sure of the title something like "Zooey and Me." Zooey was
played by Isabella Rossellini. She was a nanny (?) while Lynch played
her boyfriend, who was pretending to be this wealthy guy, but I believe
was in fact a butler.....

I remember checking it out on HBO or TMC upon seeing Rossellini's
name listed in the credits, and was shocked to see Lynch.


Sally--
-- Video meliora proboque, deteriora sequor! ### Sally A. Wilson [Ovid's _Metaphorposes_] ### sally@mica.berkeley.edu Vita non est vivere sed valere vita est. ### P. Spud Peel [Martial] ### [A member of Babble since 87]

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   It is very easy to hear things in backwards messages, especially when told
what to listen for.  In other words, what you might be hearing is basically
random, but your mind does not like thinking of something as just 'random', so
it makes you think you heard something.
   I'm not saying this is what definately happened, but it might be.
   So the way to test it is, simply saying I Is Windom Earl, or Is Windom Earl,
and reversing THAT and seeing if it sounds like Garmonbozia.  Ideally, show
it to someone that doesn't know about FWWM, and ask them to spell it out.
   If it's true, then this must be the way they got the word in the first place.

-Dres

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In article <1992Sep17.115250.2668@pdn.paradyne.com> pitchon@paradyne.com (Howard Pitchon) writes:
>From Summer Storm:
> >
> >George, did I read correctly that you think Mrs. Tremond/Chalfont (sp?) 
> >is one of the good guys? I guess that by steering Donna to Harold, 
> >she helps solve the crime, but that ultimately leads to Annie and Coop 
> >ending up in the lodge, and bashed in the face. Also, the picture that 
> >she gives to Laura in FWWM doesn't exactly lead to pleasant dreams.
> >
> >You may be right, she may be a good entity, because... the road to hell 
> >(the black lodge) may be paved w/good intentions.
> >
> >Just a thought.  
> >
> >     ------ss


 Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying she's from the White Lodge or anything
 but all other characters that appear in the red room above the convenience
 store seem to be working against Bob.
  
  Ie: Mrs. Tremond doesn't like creamed corn (garmonbozia - pain and suffering)
      The OAM in the movie says to Leland "You stole the corn!.... And Miss,
      you should have seen her face"... etc. obviously referring to Mrs. Tremond
      how she greatly disapproved of Bob's actions of stealing the corn.
      With the picture she gave Laura when she went inside it, it seemed Mrs.
      Tremond was showing her the way or inviting her to enter the Lodge (in
      order to prevent Bob from possesing her?)
      Pierre in the series said the "I'm a lonely soul" phrase to Donna as a
      hint to return there to find out about the missing page(s) of Laura's
      diary. Pierre told Laura that Bob was looking for her diary in the movie.
      Mike via the OAM in the series and the movie is out to stop Bob.
      The Log Lady's husdand communicates to her through her log to aid in
      finding clues/stopping Bob - to which she informs others of what it says.
      The LMFAP gives Cooper clues about things.. like in his dream says that
      the gum he once liked would be coming back in style to which we later
      learn that the gum he was talking about was the kind Leland liked as a
      boy.. he referred to Laura in the dream as his cousin - a reference to
      Maddy I think - warning that what happened to Laura will happen to
      Maddy?

      I think they are good in the way that they are all out to stop Bob while
      overall this is all a part of their game, Bob kills, the rest try to or
      give hints to stop him and they watch how it effects the people around
      them. Bob enjoys to kill, they enjoy trying to stop him and the circle
      keeps going until sometime it must be broken.

      -=*George*=-


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In FWWM, was the actress who appeared in Laura's bed really the same  
actress who played Annie?  She looked terrible and quite different.  Is  
this another one of those, "yes, this is supposed to be the same person  
even though she acts totally different" things like with Donna?  Is this  
some other Annie?  And why is she in the Lodge?  I thought she was out.

-- Frank
__________________________________________________________________________
Frank Price      | wprice@pomona.claremont.edu
                 | "Nothing crashes like a Macintosh."
                 |      - Guy Kawasaki

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In article <19bmdrINN6b1@agate.berkeley.edu> sally@anableps.berkeley.edu (S. A. Wilson) writes:
> >In article <Bur5vx.LD0@well.sf.ca.us> rchao@well.sf.ca.us (Robert Chao) writes:
>> >>
>> >>I remember hearing that Lynch was in a film just as an actor.
>> >>What was that film? Is it on video? What was it like?
> >
> >I am not sure of the title something like "Zooey and Me." Zooey was
> >played by Isabella Rossellini. She was a nanny (?) while Lynch played
> >her boyfriend, who [spoiler deleted]
> >
The title is "Zelly and Me". It is directed by Tina Rathbone (sp?),
who also directed the TP episode with Laura's funeral.

/Ola

--
Ola Torstensson, dat91oto@ludat.lth.se
No part of this article (including this .sig) should be taken seriously.

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I've seen FWWM two times now and I think I will go again this weekend.  It's
nice to see all the interest in the movie the posting of ideas, answers, etc.
But there is one thing I have picked up on and I don't know what it means.
So what else is new in David Lynch land?  Anyway, this thing with lipstick
appears in Blue Velvet, Wild at Heart, and in FWWM.  Remember when Dennis
Hopper smears Kyle M. in Blue Velvet?  How about Laura Dern's mom and
her face painting scene in Wild at Heart?  And now with FWWM we have the
cabin in the woods scene and also I believe the "Let's Rock" inscription.
Doesn't that appear to be written with lipstick?  The smearing is so blatant
in FWWM that I couldn't help but think about Lynch's other work and try to
draw some analogy.  I'd love to hear other comments and observations on
this.  I not quite sure what to make of it.


Bob
  




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In article <192p6nINN2an@bigboote.WPI.EDU>, mking@lizardo.WPI.EDU (Matthew Alexander King) writes:
> > 
> > 
> > Just a quick little question.  If everyone has a double in "twin" peaks,
> > then who is the Log Ladies, perhaps the log or what?


Major Briggs. Was there ever any doubt?

Mike

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In article <1992Sep15.210538.22656@cs.mun.ca>, georgen@pooky.cs.mun.ca (George Noel) writes:
>>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>George, I'm impressed. There is something that doesn't quite jive
>> >>with me though. Remember the detail that time may flow backwards in 
>> >>the Lodge, but it flows forward in our world. Even the souls/spirits
>> >>who inhabit the lodge are at time's mercy depending on where they are.
>> >>This was proven by me by the grandson who speaks in plain English
>> >>when he warns Laura about the "man behind the mask". We had no
>> >>previous knowledge of their presence in the lodge, otherwise this
>> >>point would have been sealed by the old woman's discourse with
>> >>Donna in the Tremond house. Therefore, how do you reconcile the fact
>> >>that WE soul may have been split in the last episode but in our
>> >>time he had gone psycho a long time ago? As you pointed out it is
>> >>referred to in Coop's tapes. On one plane the OAM and the LMFAP
>> >>were "split" from WE, but WE should have been normal until then.

> > When Earle is in the black lodge, he
> > has control over how he presents himself.. he appears as evil Laura, Caroline,
> > wounded Annie, evil Annie before he finals reveals to Coop his image. If you
> > doubt me, when the evil Laura screams.. "Meanwhile..." you see a quick,
> > blury image of Wyndem Earle appear over her face.. if you rewind your tape
> > and pause it when this happens it becomes quite clear and you clearly see
> > Wyndem Earle's face.. how did he get the power to alter his image?


I was just thinking...
Laura says Meanwhile.... then lets out with a scream and turns into Windom
Earle.

Or...

"Meanwhile"....... "AAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRIIIIIIIIIIIIIGGGGGGGGGHHH"!
..<I is WIndom Earle><- when the face appears over hers

Or...
Meanwhile...... Scream of pain... and since things in the Lodge go backwards...
<I is WIndom Earle> becomes... <Garmonbozia>



So we finally come up with "Meanwhile I'm in pain from Garmonbozia."


Therefore I wonder if the Lodge people trapped Laura (and maybe Coop) in 
the Lodge simply to cause them pain and sorrow, on which they feed.

Ideas?
Mike (a tottoo here, on the left shoulder...)

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> >Just a quick little question.  If everyone has a double in "twin" peaks,
> >then who is the Log Ladies, perhaps the log or what?
> >
> >Matt
> >
> >Davey baby, I think you're
> >isn't, sorry about spoilers, hope no hARM done, gee these jokes are
> >corny, creamed that is....

 Windom Earl, of course, second last episode......


***********************************************************************
*           "I am the Doctor...whether you like it or not."           *
*                  Doctor to Peri, The Twin Dilemma.                  *
***********************************************************************
*           "I'm in a deep sensation, a limbo void of time"           *
*  Paula Abdul, State of Attraction from the album Forever Your Girl  *
***********************************************************************
*                    "Damn fine coffee...and HOT!"                    *
* Cooper after sipping Lucy's coffee and spewing it out of his mouth. *
***********************************************************************

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     Hey, didn't Robert S. Salinger write the short story for that movie?
I wasn't even aware that this movie existed!


-Sean LeBlanc

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In alt.tv.twin-peaks, dgd@csd.bu.edu (David Durand) writes:

> > In article <14SEP199212361365@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov> scgeoff@lims01.lerc.nasa.gov (GEOFF ELLIOTT) writes:

> >    This makes as much sense as anything else I've read about Jacques calling 
> >    himself the "Great Went".

> > [theory about the tv show Cheers deleted that doesn't convince me, anyway]
> >    Geoff

> >  I think that perhaps it is supposed to resonate with the lost/leaving
> > theme of degradation and progressive evil. All along the image of
> > Laura is of someone "going away" being sucked farther and farther into
> > a destructive pit. Perhaps Jacques is saying that he's already long
> > gone. Perhaps it also means he's been taken over by the black lodge
> > already, and that's why he's as blank as a fart -- nothing left of the
> > original human (that had a capacity for good).

       !!! Wooo Wooo Wooo Wooo, Wooo Wooo Wooo Wooo Wooo, Wooo Wooo Wooo
Wooo Wooo !!!!   One jelly donut for Doug for getting the correct anwser
to this.

          Jacques' spirit's capacity to nuture good has decayed to fart-level.
Laura's was heading in the same direction.  Remember the closing pink room
pan of the litter of ciggies and "lagerbrau" beer cans (anybody else notice
the bogus neon beer sign?).  Lynch is making sure his audience doesn't
mistake drug *addiction* as a good thing.  Sarah Palmers' ashtrays and
sunken features reveal a cancer/rot/fart on the Palmer suburbean dream.

> >     Of course, the nonsensical nature of his expressions is clearly
> > meant to evoke that peculiar sort of conversation that takes place at
> > large crowded parties where everyone is _way out_ of a normal mental
> > state.


          Yes, and what a way out scene that was.  Lynch has perfected
"the raunchy-blues-band-from-another-place" with his sunglassed and
cowboy-hatted musical droids.

                                         Phil

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Has anyone tries to reverse "Fire walk with me", as was done with
garmonbizia?
Also, has anyone put together a list of reversed sounds and what they are?

Adrian
-- ----------------------------------+-------------------------------------------- adrian@cs.wm.edu ---->>>>| Support you local programmer, adrian@cebafi.cebaf.gov --->>>| STOP Software Patent Abuses NOW! Member: The League for -->>| membership info at prep.ai.mit.edu:/pub/lpf Programming Freedom ->| print "join.ps" for an application ----------------------------------+--------------------------------------------

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In article <1992Sep13.123559.7497@ac.dal.ca>, 01sybok@ac.dal.ca writes:
> >Allright...here goes.
> >
> >I want to get another tattoo. For long while, I've been thinking about
> >
> >getting something Twin Peaks-esque.
> >
> >Finally it hit me... the perfect tattoo...
> >
> >I want to get the pertoglyph on Theresa Banks's ring!
> >
> >Even better... *ahem* my name is Mike, so I'm going to get it on my shoulder!
> >
> >I now have two problems:
> >
> >1) I can't remember which shoulder he had it on
> >
> >2) I don't have a good clear picture of the ring. Since tattoos are permanent,
> >I need someting with the picture shown as clearly as possible, and since I plan
> >on getting to background in there too, I need the picture in COLOUR.
> >
> >Does anyone out there have a picture of the petroglyph they could send me, 
> >or does anyone know where I can find the picture? Also, for those of you in 
> >rec.arts.bodyart, is it possible to get a deep emerald green tattoo dye?
> >
> >
> >Thanks!
> >
> >Mike
> >-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
> > Ever see a mouse panic when it grasps the full implications of its place 
> >on the food chain?
> >-Jim Kasprzak
> >-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=





Sorry about not mailing you concerning this.  Something wrong with my system
here.  Anyhow, Mike had his tatoo on his left arm.  As far as having a picture,
I don't have one.  Also, is there a background to the petroglyph?






















Internet address: Floyd@ufcc.ufl.edu
Bitnet address  : Floyd@ufcc
All opinions expressed are my own or mine.

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In article <1992Sep17.061846.8064@cs.mun.ca> georgen@pooky.cs.mun.ca (George Noel) writes:
   In article <198lf0INNl9m@agate.berkeley.edu> schubert@capri.berkeley.edu.UUCP (John Schubert) writes:
   >Perhaps "Fire walk with me" [as uttered by Laura to Harold] is BOB actually
   >saying, "I want your soul".  Meaning BOB wants to be with the soul or he would
   >like to take it to the Black Lodge.  I seem to remember, having only seen the
   >movie once, that when BOB takes Windom's soul that some sort of fire sprouts
   >from Windom's head.  Or was it just smoke??
   >
   >-John
   >
   >John Schubert
   >schubert@united.berkeley.edu

    I think "Fire, walk with me" would have been/is best described in the cut
    portions of the movie. There is a scene where a ring of fire appears in the
    red room above the convenience store on the wall, Bob looks at LMFAP and
    says "Fire, walk with me" - they both walk through the ring of fire and enter
    the waiting room in the lodge. Basically its their invitation to "Home" that
    they say to someone.

In the American Cinematographer article, if I remember correctly,
there is a description of this scene.  It wasn't cut so much as
discarded.  They couldn't get it to come out in a way that looked
right to Lynch so they just decided against doing it.  So don't look
to the quasi-mythical 3:40 version for it.

-30-
Bob

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In article <kuc0qB1w165w@ailanth.UUCP>, tallman%ailanth.uucp@wang.com
(Robert Oliver) wrote:
> > 
> > 1>t tried reversing the word Garmonbozia on my Sound Blaster Pro. While 
> > others have heard "I is Windom Earle" I distinctly heard "Is Windom 
> > Earle". We know that garmonbozia is pain and suffering. Therefore I 
> > propose the following:
> >  
> > Pain and suffering . . . is Windom Earle.
> > (Garmonbozia)            (Garmonbozia reversed - Lodge Speak)
> >  
> > Pain and suffering is Windom Earle                

I did some experiments with MacRecorder.
"I is Windom Earle" reversed sounds too close to "Garmonbozia" to be a
coincidence (though it sounded just as much like "Harmonbozia" with a
gutteral H).
Since "I is Windom Earle"  is ungrammatical, I tried some variations like
"this is...", "this was". That won't fly. "is Windom Earle" backwards lacks
the 'Yuh' at the end, so something is missing,  I tried 'pain is Windom
Earle' and it was a possible, but 'I' backward gives a definite 'yuh' at
the end and I would say. 'I' has to be the leading candidate. However, if
people will e-mail me phrases which begin with something else, but continue
"is Windom Earle", I will try them. 

Maybe this is all just a little joke rather than a clue, but I am forced
against my initial reluctance to conclude that garmonbozia is backwards
speak for something very close to, if not identical with "I is Windom
Earle".

-Rich Haller

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In article <1992Sep18.063753.16281@muddcs.claremont.edu> wprice@pomona.claremont.edu writes:
> >In FWWM, was the actress who appeared in Laura's bed really the same  
> >actress who played Annie?  She looked terrible and quite different.

Check the credits.  It was Heather Graham.  And if you recall, she didn't
look too hot at the end of the finale either -- there was all that blood
around her mouth.

> >Is this  
> >some other Annie?  And why is she in the Lodge?  I thought she was out.

We know her BODY is out of the Lodge.  We don't know where her mind is
at all.

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I have now seen the movie twice, and I want to ask a few
questions for the net.

1. Who is Judy?

2. What are we to make of the fact (?) that Cooper never mentions the
missing Chet Desmond (in the series, that is)?

3. Can someone (in a few paragraphs) discuss the people beneath
the convenience store (how do we know they are actually under a
store?), the creamed corn, and the connections between the one-armed
man and BoB?

Laura is akin to Judy Garland's WIZARD OF OZ character,
Dorothy. Laura longs to find something else (her self, peace, inner
strength) but she fails to look where she can find it (right in TP),
so she goes the way of cocaine, which is a modern tornado, Lynch telling 
his viewers that modern youth are faced with a bleak world in which nothing
makes sense. 

Monkeys, dogs (Toto), the angels (the good witch), 

8888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888



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In article <1992Sep18.023458.13914@morgan.ucs.mun.ca>,
pnorman@morgan.ucs.mun.ca (Peter T. Norman) wrote:
> > 
> > In the last scene of the final episode, Cooper asks how Annie is.  I
> > paid particularly close attention this time; Coop turns to Harry when he
> > asks the question; Harry says she is fine, she is in hospital.  Harry
> > looks hesitantly at Doc Hayward, who in turn lowers his eyes and bends
> > his head down-covering his expression from Cooper.
> > 
> > The reactions of both Harry and the Doc point toward anything but good
> > news concerning Annie.  And remember Harry made several attempts to stir
> > Annie in the Grove of Sycamore trees - one attempt brought Cooper
> > around; Annie didn't respond at all.
> > 
> > It really looks to me as if Annie is dead.  I use this isolated fact to
> > ground my understand of many of the subsequent events in the Movie and
> > many of the implications of the series.  Does anyone have any reason to
> > strongly disagree with my claim (and reasoning as to why she might be
> > dead)?

My feelings were the same as yours for the same reasons until I saw the
posting of the shooting script summary. In it is the following at the end,
most of which does _not_ appear in FWWM (the whooping thing does, but in
earlier; also the line annie says appears in Laura's dream/vision):
#   -- At high tide, Laura's body floats up to and bumps against logs
#
#   -- Annie is brought on a stretcher to the hospital emergency ward
#   -- The red room.
#       {MFAP stands with Cooper}
#       MFAP:  Is it future?  Or is it past?  Do you know who I am?
#         I am The Arm.  And I sound like this...  {Indian whooping noise}
#       Cooper:  {looking at table}  Where is the ring?
#       MFAP:  Someone else has it now.
#       Cooper:  That would indicate that it's the future.
#       MFAP:  The later events have never been kept a secret.
#       Cooper:  Where am I?  _And how can I leave?_
#       MFAP:  You are here and there is no place to go...
#         {shouts}  BUT HOME!  {laughs uncontrollably}
#   -- Nurse attends to Annie.
#       Annie:  My name is Annie.  I've been with Laura and Dale.  The good
#         Dale is in the lodge and he can't leave.  Write it in your diary.
#      The nurse slides the ring off of Annie's finger.  She goes to
another
#      room and puts it on.
#   -- Truman and Doc tend to Cooper, who says he slipped and hit his head
on
#      the mirror and that it struck him as funny.
#   -- Laura is sitting on Cooper's lap in the red room

So what are we to make of this?  We could still conclude that Annie either
dies or deteriorates rapidly after this scene, that she justs briefly
revived to give this one message before dying.  Or given that the scene was
either cut or not used at all in the actual movie, it is possible that they
changed their mind because such a scene would make it seem that Annie was
OK, when they didn't want to give that impression. Or, it could be that
Annie _is_ OK and the looks are just there to misslead us.

-Rich

> > 
> > Peter

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In article <190v4kINNi6h@bigboote.WPI.EDU> mking@wpi.WPI.EDU (Matthew Alexander King) writes:
> >P.S.  Will someone please try and find out when the song "Sycamore Trees" 
> >is played during movie, oh and also check for what Laura was listening to
> >while doing coke, you know when see turns the radio on, thanks.


"Sycamore Trees" did not play in the movie. Note that the movie was edited
down to 135 minutes from 220 minutes(!!!!????!!!!)  I very glad they
decided to include the song anyway, since it's my favorite.

What song did Jimi Scott sing in the final episode?  Wasn't it an
excerpt from Sycamore Trees?  

ferenc




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INDIANS: Indian Legends, Indian Head Gas, Indian Whooping Noise, Johnny(Indian Headdress)


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In article <1992Sep14.011327.27368@hemlock.cray.com> nad@cray.com (Ned Deily) writes:
> >Anyone notice that, in the shot where Leyland is scurrying away from
> >Theresa in the motel parking lot (after seeing L & R in the motel
> >room), while Tresmond petit-fils is hopping around with the
> >mask on the left side of the screen, a trailer is shown parked
> >on the right side?  Is it possible that the gang set up the
> >Tresmond trailer at the motel in anticipation of fresh garb?

Nice theory, but that trailer has been out in front of the motel for
several years, at least as long as I've been living there. (No, I don't
live at the motel, just a mile or so down the road from it.  The tacky
neon sign is a great navigational landmark.)

Don


-- 

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In article <1992Sep18.063753.16281@muddcs.claremont.edu< wprice@pomona.claremont.edu writes:
<In FWWM, was the actress who appeared in Laura's bed really the same  
<actress who played Annie?  She looked terrible and quite different.  

Funny.  I recognized her instantly, she looked to me identical
to Annie (except the wound), facial expressions, voice, everything.  Really.

<And why is she in the Lodge?  I thought she was out.
<
Laura is dreaming and has a premonition of the future.  BTW, I don't
quite subscribe to the "time runs backward in the lodge" theory.  It is 
too smooth an explanation and reduces the events in TP to some sort of Mickey
Mouse physics that only needs to be applied to straighten everything up.
It seems to me some characters are able to "see" different "times" in
both "our world" and "the waiting room world" (or whatever it is) so these
visions appear all mixed up and frequently backwards.

Jan Bielawski
Computervision, San Diego
jpb@calmasd.prime.com


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In article <15305@umd5.umd.edu> jblum@hamlet.umd.edu (Hi ho -- Kermit the Frog here...) writes:
> >In article <1992Sep3.165652.1595@scubed.com> stevens@scubed.com (Jeff Stevens) writes:
> >Spoiler sightings...
> >
> >
> >
> >No golf ball in the final version.  Hmm.  Also, the Jefferies scene comes
> >after Desmond's disappearance.  I'm surprised that the summary doesn't so
> >much as mention the Tremonds.
> >

I have a  copy  of  the  shooting script dated 8/8/91 and
registered with the WGA.  In my copy, the Jeffries scene comes just 
after Desmond's disappearance.  Otherwise, almost everything in the
plot summary matches the shooting script.
The Tremonds are certainly in the script.

>> >>She wakes and looks next to her.  "She  discovers Annie
>> >>Blackburn lying in bed with her."  She has blood around her mouth and she
>> >>says, "My name is Annie.  I've been with Laura and Dale.  The good Dale is
>> >>in the lodge and he can't leave.  Write it in your diary."  Aniie disappears
>> >>and the ring is in Laura's hand.
> >
> >See?  It _IS_ Annie!  Nyah nyah nyah nyah nyah!  :-)
> >
>> >>Laura and Donna hitch up with a few truckers.  They see Ronette Pulaski
>> >>and Bob's voice tells Laura that Donna is going to get into the situation.
>> >>Laura is afraid for Donna and tries to get her out of there.
> >
> >WHOA.  This is new.  Wonder if this ties in with Leland's near-attack on
> >Donna in 2009?
> >
There are a couple of  occasions in the script where Bob seems
to be disembodied.  One time, Laura is alone in the house and hears
Bob's voice as she passes under the fan.

> >No ascent to heaven scene either.  Maybe the producers felt the movie was
> >too bleak as it stood, and added on a "happy" ending later?...
> >
I suspect you're right.

> >Also -- did the script specify that the Red Room where Laura and Coop was
> >is the Black Lodge?...
> >
Sorry.  The script calls it...  THE RED ROOM.  You knew Lynch
wouldn't make it too easy ;-)

-- -John John J. Humpal -- johnh@jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu -- short .sig, std. disclaimer

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In article <1992Sep18.023458.13914@morgan.ucs.mun.ca>, pnorman@morgan.ucs.mun.ca (Peter T. Norman) writes...
> >In the last scene of the final episode, Cooper asks how Annie is.  I
> >paid particularly close attention this time; Coop turns to Harry when he
> >asks the question; Harry says she is fine, she is in hospital.  Harry
> >looks hesitantly at Doc Hayward, who in turn lowers his eyes and bends
> >his head down-covering his expression from Cooper.
> > 
> >The reactions of both Harry and the Doc point toward anything but good
> >news concerning Annie.  And remember Harry made several attempts to stir
> >Annie in the Grove of Sycamore trees - one attempt brought Cooper
> >around; Annie didn't respond at all.
> > 
> >It really looks to me as if Annie is dead.  I use this isolated fact to
> >ground my understand of many of the subsequent events in the Movie and
> >many of the implications of the series.  Does anyone have any reason to
> >strongly disagree with my claim (and reasoning as to why she might be
> >dead)?

> >Peter

     I dunno...  Annie was definitely ALIVE in that final scene:
     Truman does say she's fine... in the hospital... (those
     two statements could cancel each other out, I suppose...
     if you look at it that way).
     As for Doc's expression - this could very well indicate a
     coma or something "not good" with regard to Annie's 
     condition -- but, I mean, give the guy (Doc, I mean) a
     break -- he'd had a bad day himself, you know?

                 Shortly  thereafter, the health of  Annie
                 Blackburn still in question, the behavior
                 of Special Agent  Dale Cooper was noticed
                 __________________________to have changed.
                                              Scott Gorcey.            

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Someone else echoed what I had been thinking about when they
said they would be more convinced if "I is Windom Earle" had
something to do with eyes rather than "I".  Why not "Eye is
Windom Earle"?  Can anyone think of a significance for this?

--
 ___            _    _     _  _        _
(  _) ___ ___ _( )__( )_  ( )( ) o  __( ) _  ___  ___  ___
(___)(_) (__=) (_)_ (_)_   (__) (_)(_((_)(_'(__=)(_) _(_)
Brett J. Vickers (bvickers@ics.uci.edu)

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I am pretty sure that Guenivere was resuced from Melwas by Lancelot, not
Aurthur. 
So, if Cooper is Lancelot..who is Arthur? Maybe the man that Annie
slit her wrists for? 
It would be interesting to do a whole scale comparison of TW to King
Arthur: 
The bookhouse boys - The Knights of the Round Table
Lancelot - Cooper
Gwen - Annie
Merlin - Mike/OAM
Mordred  - BOB
Morgan le Fey - maybe the log lady ???

Arthur - ?
Well...actually, since Mordred is Arthur's son, I don't know really
where he could fit in...
Of course it seems to be a stretch...but interesting...

Susan

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Larry Yaeger (larryy@gallant.apple.com) wrote:
: In article <1992Sep13.202953.28563@cco.caltech.edu> UnoJ writes:
: >Very puzzling is the dichotomy shown towards the ring by two of
: >the actors who are supposedly helping Laura: Coop warns her not to
: >take it (perhaps he thinks that she is not ready for it yet) but
: >the OAM tosses it to her and off she goes on her raod to salvation.
: 
: My interpretation of this is that Coop, perhaps due to simple lack of
: knowledge, perhaps due to insufficient spiritual advancement, is
: only trying to protect Laura's body - to prevent her physical death -
: while the OAM/MIKE, understanding the much higher stakes involved, is
: trying to protect her soul (even at the cost of her life).
: -- 

I think that the question is which Coop told Laura not to take the
ring. I feel it was the evil Coop. It seems that if laura had not take
the ring then BOB/Leleand may have been able to posses her. This seems
to be indicated by Leland saying don't make me do this to you and LP's
response of putting on the ring and saying no you hve to kill me (Or
something to  that effect) It makes more sense to me that the BOB/Coop
would tell LP not to put the ring.
But then again
--
===============================================================================
    "I was kind of dissapointed actually. I mean here he is the great and
    evil BOB and the worst thing he can do is squeeze a tube of toothpaste
                            out from the middle."
            -Something Someone Said About The Finale Of Twin Peaks
Matthew Frazer              |   Matthew Frazer    | But You Can Call Me 
Skidmore College            |   5 Stevens Way     |  mfrazer@skidmore.edu
Saratoga Springs NY 12866   |   Durham NH 03824   | 
===============================================================================
                              Be Seeing You!
===============================================================================


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On the subject of cutting down FWWM to focus exclusively on Laura's death:

I dont think that this would help the film at all.  I already knew all the
stuff about Laura from the show and Jennifer Lynch's SECRET DIARY OF LAURA
PALMER.  To me the middle of FWWM was just an illustration of a story that had
already been told, but left more to our imagination.  It was interesting to
see, but frankly, I like the version in my head better.  It was the new stuff,
Agent Jeffries and the like that really interested me.  As far as I am
concerned if you are going to cut anything, cut the Laura Stuff, or better yet
don't cut anything!

A.J. LoCicero >> cicero@hotcity.com

This message comes to you from beautiful Morgan Hill, California, U.S.A.:
The front line in the war against Suburbanization!

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In article <1992Sep15.212622.10656@athena.mit.edu>, thomasl@mtl.mit.edu (Thomas
J Lohman) writes:
> >In article <goldberg.716497580@vincent1.iastate.edu> goldberg@iastate.edu
(Adam 
> >Goldberg) writes:
> >
>> >>Jefferies (Bowie) was definitely in "Time phase" (something to do with the
>> >>time loop).  He witnessed a meeting of the "aliens" but escaped before he
>> >>could be imprisoned in wood.  This seems to relate to the "thread" that is
> >
>> >>Wood is the aliens method of containment/imprisonment.
> >
> >Why wood?  Just because of the Josie death epsiode?  Both my friend and
> >I who enjoyed the show thought that that was rather "goofy" to say the least.
> >Some druid influence among the aliens no doubt.
> >
> >
> >--tom
> >
Hmmm... Wood, like as in Log perhaps?

A.J. LoCicero >> cicero@hotcity.com

This message comes to you from beautiful Morgan Hill, California, U.S.A.:
The front line in the war against Suburbanization!

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In article <BuKwI2.G97@acsu.buffalo.edu> v075q5fr@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Scott J Gorcey) writes:
> >From: v075q5fr@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Scott J Gorcey)
> >Subject: The Great Went - Duality Role Playing in Twin Peaks
> >Date: 14 Sep 92 17:27:00 GMT
> >
> >     Everybody in Twin Peaks has a double.
> >     Whether its a physical double - such as Leland/BOB, Senor Droolcup/
> >     The Giant, or Laura/Maddy - or a spiritual/mental double, such
> >     as Donna, the innocent and Donna, the bitch; Nadine the bitch,
> >     Nadine the teenager; Josie the sweet, Josie the vicious; etc.
> >
> >     Twin Peaks is playing, sometimes elaborately, sometimes for fun,
> >     with the concepts of duality - from different halves of a
> >     character's personality, to bumps on the head, etc; sometimes
> >     for serious: dopplegangers, possessions, harbinger/visitations,
> >     etc.
> >
AND, of course, that's why its called *TWIN* Peaks anyway...
                                       ^^^^
GREG

======================================================================
Gregory Hutchison           ||  "You are never given a wish without
Rhodes University           ||   also being given the power to make
Grahamstown                 ||   it true.
South Africa                ||     You may have to work for it,
<g92h7147@giraffe.ru.ac.za> ||     however." - Richard Bach
======================================================================

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cs125c51@dcl-nxt31.cso.uiuc.edu (cs125 student) writes:

> > I just found this group, so pardon if this is an old Q:
> > 
> > What is the story with "On The Air"? I loved it. Any chance of it returning, 
> > perhaps as a mid-season replacement, or is it history?

There were only 2 or 3 episodes broadcast if I remember correctly?

--                    
INTERNET:  jim@netlink.cts.com (Jim Bowery)
UUCP:   ...!ryptyde!netlink!jim
NetLink Online Communications * Public Access in San Diego, CA (619) 453-1115

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tallman%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Robert Oliver) writes:

> >  
> > Glastonbury is a small town in Somerset England. It is believed to be the 
> > site of Britain's first Christian community. Some tidbits about 
> > Glastonbury gleaned from the many tales of King Arthur:
> >  
> > 1. Lancelot's retreat
> > 2. Somehow associated with the Grail
> > 3. The burial site of Arthur (Cooper?)
> > 4. Derived from the celtic word Glastonia meaning "blue-green"
> > 5. The highest hill in Glastonbury is the Tor, which many folk beliefs 
> > claim is hollow and is an entry to the underworld or otherworld (The 
> > Lodges?).
> > 6. Guenevere (Annie?) was kidnapped by King Melwas (Windom Earle?) and 
> > kept in a stronhold in Glastonbury (The Lodges?), later to be rescued by 
> > Arthur (Cooper?).

Neopagans of Celtic (Irish -- like Lynch) origin refer to their
worship groups as "The Grove".  The place in astral space where
initiates are first taken (in some traditions) is called "Our Lady's
Grove" which is subsequently used as a safe haven.

Now when you get a mixing of deep traditions, such as the invasion of
North America by Northern Europeans, it is reasonable to assume the
cultures will do more than just conflict -- they will synthesize.

--                    
INTERNET:  jim@netlink.cts.com (Jim Bowery)
UUCP:   ...!ryptyde!netlink!jim
NetLink Online Communications * Public Access in San Diego, CA (619) 453-1115

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pnorman@morgan.ucs.mun.ca (Peter T. Norman) writes:

> > In the last scene of the final episode, Cooper asks how Annie is.  I
> > paid particularly close attention this time; Coop turns to Harry when he
> > asks the question; Harry says she is fine, she is in hospital.  Harry
> > looks hesitantly at Doc Hayward, who in turn lowers his eyes and bends
> > his head down-covering his expression from Cooper.
> > 
> > The reactions of both Harry and the Doc point toward anything but good
> > news concerning Annie.  And remember Harry made several attempts to stir
> > Annie in the Grove of Sycamore trees - one attempt brought Cooper
> > around; Annie didn't respond at all.
> > 
> > It really looks to me as if Annie is dead.  I use this isolated fact to
> > ground my understand of many of the subsequent events in the Movie and
> > many of the implications of the series.  Does anyone have any reason to
> > strongly disagree with my claim (and reasoning as to why she might be
> > dead)?
> > 
> > Peter

Some of the footage left out of the movie (which I believe runs 3:40) 
includes some scenes with Annie in the hospital.

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I have been going through the series for the third time now and I have 
some trivial questions, perhaps FAQs.

Who was with Leo when Bobby and Mike ego to the woods to pick up the 
football of cocaine?  One of the Bernaud(sp) brothers? [early episode]

When Bob leaves Leland's body in that scene where the sprinklers come
on in the jail cell, why does Leland always say "They made me do it"?
Why doesn't he say 'He' made me do it, as in BOB?

Did Donna, after Mrs. Tremond (middle-aged lady) gives her the letter
from Harold, know that Leland is Laura's killer?  I get that impression,
because otherwise it doesn't explain why she went to their house to tell
Leland about the secret diary.
Also, didn't Harold kill himself the night after Donna and Maddy try to
take the diary.  How did he manage to mail that letter to Donna?

When Norma's mother (alledgely M.T. Wentz) is eating her omlets, she spits
it out and comments about the fowl where the egg came from <forgot the words
she used>.  After that, she says if she ate anymore that she might run into a 
thumbtack.  Does she mean a thumbtack in the eggs?  Or is this an expression 
that means the eggs are terrible? <told you my questions were trivial>

Where does Bobby take this receipt to claim Leo's old boots from?  A shoe
repair shop?  If so, would it not be possible for the repair shop to 
accidentaly come across the tape in the sole?  Or were they just suppose
to clean the shoes?

Is Mrs. Tremond's grandson played by David Lynch's son or something?

In the roadhouse, the night Maddy is killed, Donna is sitting in a both
with James.  The Giant tells Cooper that it is happening again.  He goes,
she starts crying.  Why?
Also, Bobby has this remorseful look on his face.  Why?
Does anyone know if the Log Lady saw the Giant up on the stage.

When WowoW (Japan Satellite Broadcasting Co.) showed the series, they
included litte snippets before and after every three or four episodes
about the characters, and recapped the highlights of what had happened
so far.  At the end of the series.  They show an interview with Sheryl
Lee (there were lots of interviews) where she mentions that nobody, not 
even the cast knew who the killer was going to be.  When the time had come, 
she, Ray Wise, and Richard Beymer are called up to Lynch's office, and are 
finally told who the killer will be.  She says, that they were equally 
amazed.  She also says that three different versions of Maddy's killing was 
shot, one with Leland, Ben, and BOB.  This was so that the crew would not 
know which would be aired. Except that the one with BOB would be shown off 
and on with the actual killer.
Wouldn't you like to see the one with Ben doing the killing scene?  

Also, there is a catch to the RR Diner neon sign that the JSB people, or
whoever was making the short snippets, found interesting.  It is only mildly
interesting, if anything, but they say that the Diner actually exists (ho hum)
and that they used a neon with the double RR logo for the series by simply
placing it on the existing sign.  At times, they could not do this, so
they shot the diner from an angle so that the tree would hide where the
RR was supposed to go.  <I'm sounding like Lucy Moran>.  
Well, I found a scene where they shot it from a lower angle without putting 
the RR on it, AND without concealing the part where the RR should go, such 
as with the tree.  Does anyone understand what I'm talking about?  Is this 
a shooting mistake?

peeve: That check for $5 million that was given to Ben Horne by Catherine
(Mr. Tajamura) did not say the Bank of Tokyo on it.  It said 
something completely different.

Interesting aside: The person that did the Japanese language subtitles
for FWWM hired a friend of mine (who does English subtitles for Japanese 
movies) over to screen it with her so that he could help her grasp the 
meaning of everything.  I asked my friend what FWWM was like and he said 
it was impossible to tell (not just because he has to maintain 
confidentiality) but because the film had a masking over it when played 
back on the deck.  Sorta like a porno flick but worse.

Alas, I have yet to see the movie.
 ----------------------------------------------------------------------
|Joji Matsuo | From the country where black art is used to control|
|joji@twics.co.jp | pornography.                                       |
 ----------------------------------------------------------------------

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In article J8v@news.cso.uiuc.edu, ash50842@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Dres) writes:
> > 
> >    Maybe it's just me, but has anyone noticed yet how odd it is that the
> > Trailer Park guy says that many people have been visiting Teresa's place?
> > I mean, Teresa had no family, no friends, and so not many people would care
> > just to see where she used to live.  And I'm sure the cops didn't spend too
> > much time looking for clues in there, if they went in there at all.
> >    So what's the deal?  Who are the visitors?
> >    I would say that the ice-pack woman is one of the visitors, stopping in to
> > see the trailer.  But why did she come in?  What was the whole point of that
> > sequence?
> > 
> > THEORY:  Well I think perhaps the people that have been visiting were from the
> > lodges.  Both of them.  They were looking for the ring, which no one found
> > because it was under the Deputy's trailer.  The ice-pack lady is one of them,
> > from the White Lodge, because she gives Desmond a (helpful?) vision.
> > 
> > Then Desmond found it, went to the Lodge in his new reverse-time-stream, and
> > gave the ring to the OAM.
> > 
> > So, plausible or not?
> > 
> > -Dres

I think that is an interesting point about the visitors.  I also noticed that in
the movie, but had just assumed that it had been traffic from the Deer Meadow cops
(although with the Deputy living in the trailer park, you would think that they
wouldn't have had to mess with the park manager much).

THEORY COMMENTS: The ring was found under the Chalfonts/Tremonds trailer, not the 
Deputy's. What vision did the ice-pack woman give to Desmond?  I did not see any
indication that Desmond was having a vision.

On the *OTHER* hand, something that really interested me, was the park manager's 
(Harry Dean Stanton's) reaction to the ice-pack woman.  He was joking with Desmond
and Stanley about the coffee (bad, by the way (TP inverse again)), generally in a 
good mood.  Then the ice-pack woman made her appearance.  Desmond just seemed
curious about her.  Stanton, however, looked like he had been shot.  The moment
he saw her, he just looked like everything drained right out of him.  She left.
Stanton continued to look shocked/terrified.  Desmond and Stanley were now staring
at HIM, wondering what in the hell was going on.  As Stanton, tried to snap out of
it, he started looking like he was going to cry.  And what were the first things
he said?

"I've already been places.  I just want to stay right here, now" {close enough}

I interpret that to mean that Stanton also has had some kind of contact with the
lodge. The Chalfonts' didn't seem to mean anything special to him, but he freaked
out over the ice-pack woman.

What does everyone else make of this?


-Trebor

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Hi!

  Well, being the curious lad that I am, and being lucky enough to have
a microphone hooked tmy mac, how could I resist such a tempting experiment
as listening to "Garmonbozia" backwards to see if it sound like "I is Windom
Earle"... :)

  Anyway, I can't say my experiments were very conclusive. I think we'll
have to wait for TP:FWWM to be out on video to be sure. The problem is in the
pronounciation of Garmonbozia. Let's say that when I tried it, it *almost*
sounded like "I is Windom Earle", but not really.

  On the other hand, when I tried to reverse "I is Window Earle", I did find
that it sounded like "Garmonbozia"! So I guess my own conclusions are:
  this is a possibility, but not yet proved (by me). We'll have to wait for the
  video tape. Darn.

  Any questions? (Please don't question my sanity, I would find it very
difficult to have to prove some semblance of stability, thanks).

   Thierry
   thierry@ozrout.uucp


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In article <2ABA9E53.23329@ics.uci.edu>, bvickers@net3.ics.uci.edu (Brett
J. Vickers) wrote:
> > 
> > Someone else echoed what I had been thinking about when they
> > said they would be more convinced if "I is Windom Earle" had
> > something to do with eyes rather than "I".  Why not "Eye is
> > Windom Earle"?  Can anyone think of a significance for this?

After experimenting with MacRecorder, I have come to the following
conclusions.

1. Whatever the phrase is, it definitely starts with 'I' or 'eye' (or
another word with that intial sound.
2. It definitely ends with 'Windom Earle'.
3. It is not clear what comes inbetween.

Here are two phrases that to my ear (unfortunately I am hard of hearing and
wear hearing aids) sound close to 'garmonbozia' when played backward.

1. "I saw Windom Earle".
2. "Eyes of Windom Earle".

The original hypothesis, "I is Windom Earle", is also a candidate.

When I try recording 'garmonbozia' using the same intonation, as the MFAP,
the part that is in the middle and is in dispute, sounds like 'zaw' to me.

I have found no way to get a 'b' sound, except by using 'b'.  My current
theory is that there is no b in the phrase. It was introduced by MFAP when
he pronounces what he hears when the phrase is played backward to him.  It
could be the result, I suppose, of the sound equivalent of an 'optical
illusion' produced by the actual sounds when played in reverse.  However,
it may also be the case that the 'b' is in there because visually we have
creamed corn, and maybe there was a conscious or unconcious connection with
garbanzo beans.

This may be my last post until I find an nntp server that carries
alt.tv.twin-peaks and will let me connect.  If there is someone out there
who will do me that favor, please contact me by e-mail. The powers that be
here at the University of Oregon have decided that we must drop the alt
groups.

This has been a lot of fun. Hope to type at you again some time.

-Rich Haller <rhaller@oregon.uoregon.edu>

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In article <7DRcRB1w165w@netlink.cts.com>, jim@netlink.cts.com (Jim Bowery) writes...
> >cs125c51@dcl-nxt31.cso.uiuc.edu (cs125 student) writes:
> > 
>> >> I just found this group, so pardon if this is an old Q:
>> >> 
>> >> What is the story with "On The Air"? I loved it. Any chance of it returning, 
>> >> perhaps as a mid-season replacement, or is it history?
> > 
> >There were only 2 or 3 broadcasts if I remember correctly...?

     Robert Iger hated ON THE AIR.  The 6 episodes produced were
     it, actually.  It was supposed to be a mid-season replacement,
     but ABC "cancelled" it before it was ever broadcast.

                 Shortly  thereafter, the health of  Annie
                 Blackburn still in question, the behavior
                 of Special Agent  Dale Cooper was noticed
                 __________________________to have changed.
                                              Scott Gorcey.            

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v075q5fr@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Scott J Gorcey) writes:

> >     Robert Iger hated ON THE AIR.  The 6 episodes produced were
> >     it, actually.  It was supposed to be a mid-season replacement,
> >     but ABC "cancelled" it before it was ever broadcast.

so, how many episodes *were* broadcast??? Here, in Boston, only 2 were 
shown. I've heard that there was a third one broadcast, but have never
seen it or heard from anybody who has a copy of it. 

Does it actually exist? Is somebody willing to loan me a copy???
-- Jason Bilsky fuzzbox@world.std.com "Got enough guilt to start my own religon."

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Perhaps if time flows backwards in the lodge..
At the end of the two seasons..we see Coop possessed by Bob, right?
well, what if (in reference to when BOB says to Coop in TP in the
Leland confession episode, "Just like in Pittsburg")...What if...
What if he is referring to time earlier (in the lodge) where Coop was
already possessed..and what if..Coop killed Caroline..and that was the
end of his 'circle' where the possession (of Coop) is the beginning???

Yes...a big "what if"
but it occurred to me after reading George's posting...
Susan

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went - An archaic past tense and past participle of WEND, now used as
past tnese of GO

wend - To direct or proceed on one's course or way. To travel;
proceed; go.

This definition might support the supposition that Jacques meaning was
in reference to how far he has gone with the darkness. (?)

Susan

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In article <28325@twics.co.jp> joji@twics.co.jp writes:
> >I have been going through the series for the third time now and I have 
> >some trivial questions, perhaps FAQs.

> >Who was with Leo when Bobby and Mike ego to the woods to pick up the 
> >football of cocaine?  One of the Bernaud(sp) brothers? [early episode]

Good question, actually.  My money is on Dr. Jacoby, since we find out
later that he's been watching Leo.  The other popular theory is that it
is Jacques Renault, or maybe Bernie.

> >When Bob leaves Leland's body in that scene where the sprinklers come
> >on in the jail cell, why does Leland always say "They made me do it"?
> >Why doesn't he say 'He' made me do it, as in BOB?

Because back at the time when he killed Teresa, MIKE and BOB were still
partners.  We still don't know how / if Leland knew MIKE, or the one-armed
man.

> >Did Donna, after Mrs. Tremond (middle-aged lady) gives her the letter
>from Harold, know that Leland is Laura's killer?  I get that impression,
> >because otherwise it doesn't explain why she went to their house to tell
> >Leland about the secret diary.

She went to Leland's to ask about Maddy, I thought.  The wanted to get her
that tape of "Forever In Love" which they'd recorded.  The subject of the
diary just came up because they were talking about Laura, and Donna's
sudden resemblance to her.

> >Also, didn't Harold kill himself the night after Donna and Maddy try to
> >take the diary.  How did he manage to mail that letter to Donna?

Good question.  Then again, the film raises the question of how that page
ever existed, since Harold received the diary several days before those
entries were written.  My guess is that Laura kept writing down diary
entries for herself even after she gave away the diary, and decided to
mail them to old "Mrs. Tremond", who she knows in the movie.  I don't think
it's clear when the real Mrs. Tremond received the letter; maybe someone
can correct me on this.  Still, her close encounters with Mrs. Tremond and
Pierre in the film (that's not a spoiler really!) implies that maybe she
felt she could trust them with knowledge about BOB.

> >Is Mrs. Tremond's grandson played by David Lynch's son or something?

Yes.  In the film, he's played by a completely different but similar-looking
actor.

> >In the roadhouse, the night Maddy is killed, Donna is sitting in a both
> >with James.  The Giant tells Cooper that it is happening again.  He goes,
> >she starts crying.  Why?

Movie spoiler.  There are hints that Donna's sudden transformation from
nice-girl to weirdo is connected to something in the movie which begins at
the Roadhouse.  Maybe she too gets a sense that "it is happening again" --
that the process that corrupted Laura is happening to her.

Or maybe not.  It could just be that she's breaking down at the thought of
her part in Harold Smith's death.

> >Also, Bobby has this remorseful look on his face.  Why?

I didn't see too much remorse -- I think he's looking at James and Donna
with a vague expression of cluelessness.  He doesn't know how James got away
from the planted cocaine from before.  He also has completely missed
everything that just happened on-stage.

> >Does anyone know if the Log Lady saw the Giant up on the stage.

No.  We don't know.

> >Well, I found a scene where they shot it from a lower angle without putting 
> >the RR on it, AND without concealing the part where the RR should go, such 
> >as with the tree.  Does anyone understand what I'm talking about?  Is this 
> >a shooting mistake?

I'd guess so.  When was this?  Which episode?

> >Alas, I have yet to see the movie.

See it if at all possible.


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I don't know if this information has been posted before.  I apologize
if it has.  I was reading an article about fwwm in a local free weekly 
newspaper.  It had the following interesting quote:

"In many tribes, the owl has a sinister meaning. In the 
 Northwest, the owl calls out names of men and women who
 will die soon.  Among the Sioux and the Hin-Han, the 
 owl guards the entrance to the Milky Way over which the
 souls of the dead must pass to reach the Spirit Land. 
 Those who fail the owl's inspection because they do not
 have the proper tatoo on their wrists or elsewhere are 
 thrown into a bottomless abyss."

From "American Indian Myths and Legends", pp 399-400. 
Editors: Ortiz and Erdoes

The article was a favorable, but somewhat inaccurate, review of the
movie.  It says that when Annie appears in Laura's bed she has
two blue roses.  I did not notice this.  Did anybody see blue roses,
or shall I chalk this up as yet another factual error in the article?

-- John Pane pane+@cmu.edu School of Computer Science UCC 200 Carnegie Mellon University (412) 268-6774

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In article <15523@umd5.umd.edu> jblum@hamlet.umd.edu (Hi ho -- Kermit the Frog
here...) writes:
> >It seems like you had expectations of your own, though.  You expected
> >another episode of Twin Peaks: The Series, building more onto the mysteries
> >established in hour after hour of television.

Wow Kermit wow! You nailed me here. I remember having an
argument once with a person I was accusing of not being tolerant
enough while I was pretenting to be the most tolerant person
in the world. You can see where this is going: my argument
floundered and flailed. But in this case I am blaming it to
my inability of expression. What I meant is what Kermit is pointing
out in this next paragraph:

> >If I had any expectations, it was that I would get to see a film by
> >David Lynch.  Nothing more.  It would have the powerful storytelling
> >of "Blue Velvet" and the weird somehow-it-all-hangs-together logic
> >of "Eraserhead", two absolutely fabulous films.

My point exactly. Bravo for making it so clear to me, too.


> >
> >What I saw left me moved -- devastated, even.  My girlfriend and I walked
> >out of the theater at the end holding tightly onto each other... and
> >that was the second time I saw it, so I knew what was coming and it still
> >hit me hard.  I loved this film.

As I said before it is another glimpse into the TP world.
One that we were not really aware of before (I am including
all events in the movie under the "TP world" moniker). Of 
course, especially the Deer Meadow goings-on. You are
probably going to disagree with me here, but those were the
_new_ events which we really knew little about. Most of the
new theories the group has advanced are largely based on events
that occured during the first half of the movie.
> >
> >But it was not a perfect movie.

No it was not.

> >
> >A perfect movie would not have garnered the reactions from the non-fans
> >who sat behind me at the first showing.  They snickered and laughed at
> >all the wrong moments -- every time the LMFAP said anything incomprehensible.
> >They fidgeted through the first half-hour of the film, giggled at the
> >white horse, and made vague "what the hell is this" noises at the sight
> >of Lil the dancing girl.

I noticed it, too. Everything that was weird was met by TP
newbies with a laughter while I was concentrating trying to
assimilate all the details that were flashing by on the screen.
> >
> >When Blue Velvet came out, I saw it with a bunch of friends who were in
> >that kind of a mood, and the film gripped even us by the throat and forced us
> >to listen to what it said.  We had known nothing about Lumberton or David
> >Lynch, and the film still grabbed us.
> >
> >That's powerful filmmaking.

In a sentence you have probably distilled David Lynch's 
abilities: _powerful_. Yes, if a watcher/listener pays
close attention to his movies they grip you like a lamprey
and don't let go. If there is anything I remember from
TP is David Lynch's ability in knowing how to make a particular
scene keep your interest. I notice that in all episodes he
directed there is always something, let's call it the X factor
for lack of a better term, that stands out. Among the most
powerful scenes, from the top of my head: Maddy's murder. It
could have been filmed so ordinarily, but in this scene the
X factor was added by the distorted sounds and the sounds of
the popping record. Probably the best scene. Another scene
was, from the same episode, Leland watching himself in the
mirror and Bob's face superimposed in the reflection: the X 
factor is the mirror (what happens if you look into the mirror
today?) and Bob's manic grin. And so on, the drapes in the red
room and I could go on and on...

> >
> >Twin Peaks: Fire Walk With Me had the potential to do that to audiences.
> >Some of the scenes -- Laura with James at the end, and BOB at Laura's
> >bookcase -- were the kind of moments that movies live for.  But there
> >was still too much stuff that lessened the intensity.

You are correct here, but there should be a little respite
from intensity now and then...so I think that there was
a good amount of intensity in the right spots. Although some
scenes that were undoubtedly intense lost some of its grip
due to the sheer difficulty in understanding them. The boy
dancing behind Leland (intense, but what was that all about?) 
and the LMFAP saying that the table is green (say what?).
I think (very personal opinion) that these scenes were very
powerful yet very frustrating because as a TP die-hard I have
no clue about their significance.  

> >
> >Now, as a Peaks fan, I liked the first half-hour of the film.  In fact,
> >I would have loved to have seen it explored in much greater depth, as a
> >separate movie.  A film made strictly with the fannish audience in mind,
> >with the somewhat lighter touch of the series.

Not really....the best parts about David Lynch are when
he is able to sharply contrast an intense scene with
some funny remark that shouldn't belong. When Andy starts
weeping over Laura's body in the pilot. The scene is very
solemn, yet Andy's reaction is comical. In the scene 
where the OAM faints at the Great Northern there are a myriad
seamen bouncing balls on the ground. We are about to discover
the murderer (or so we think), and David Lynch presents us this.
The impact of this duality is enormous. That's why I say: keep
both parts, the funny and the serious. They complement each other.

> >
> >But piggybacked onto the story of Laura Palmer, it lessened the impact
> >of what is a truly universal story.  The story of a woman coming to
> >terms with her life and her death.  A story which, if allowed to play
> >out without distractions, would have silenced even the most carping of
> >critics. 
> >
> >Twin Peaks itself is simply too big a story to fit into two hours.  It's
> >like the awful movies they've made of Homer's Odyssey: either adventures
> >are left out entirely, or they are whittled down to incomprehensible
> >passing moments.  I think neither Laura's story nor Teresa's deserves
> >that fate.

Ah yes...I could make a masturbatory remark and say that I want
Lynch to make a million TP movies but I am content to wallow in what
we have already.


Final remark: Someone pointed out earlier that this newsgroup
has a high signal to noise ratio. To me Kermit's posting was
an example of that truism. Kermit could have very easily flamed
my reply to his/her posting (his I assume ;-)). Instead he 
thought out an excellent reply. 


    UnoJ

> >



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In article <rhaller-180992103613@rhaller.cc.uoregon.edu>
rhaller@oregon.uoregon.edu (Rich Haller) writes:
> >I did some experiments with MacRecorder.
> >"I is Windom Earle" reversed sounds too close to "Garmonbozia" to be a
> >coincidence (though it sounded just as much like "Harmonbozia" with a
> >gutteral H).
> >Since "I is Windom Earle"  is ungrammatical, I tried some variations like
> >"this is...", "this was". That won't fly. "is Windom Earle" backwards lacks
> >the 'Yuh' at the end, so something is missing,  I tried 'pain is Windom
> >Earle' and it was a possible, but 'I' backward gives a definite 'yuh' at
> >the end and I would say. 'I' has to be the leading candidate. However, if
> >people will e-mail me phrases which begin with something else, but continue
> >"is Windom Earle", I will try them.

Rich Haller, ultimate TP freak. Good job on this one Rich.
You get an A+ from me. The Windom Earle coincidence is too
obvious to be accidental, I agree. I would be extremely
curious to hear the actual spoken words from the movie
read backwards, i.e., we have to wait fro the video to come
out before getting anywhere on this. The actors _must_ have known
something when they were speaking that way. 
My theory: Windom Earle is not a supernatural being. In fact he
is easily disposed of by Bob. But garmonbozia and WE bring
pain and suffering: one in the Lodge (hence backwards) and
the other in the real world (hence the straight "I is WE").
  
> >
> >Maybe this is all just a little joke rather than a clue, but I am forced
> >against my initial reluctance to conclude that garmonbozia is backwards
> >speak for something very close to, if not identical with "I is Windom
> >Earle".
> >
> >-Rich Haller
> >
How true...maybe Lynch, aware of all the wild theories, threw
this one out on us to try to dissect.

    
      
      UnoJ

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In article <197ts1INN6hr@gap.caltech.edu> UnoJ writes:
> >In article <1992Sep15.231208.23932@cs.mun.ca> georgen@pooky.cs.mun.ca (George
> >Noel) writes:
> > The Giant and the LMFAP, from the last
>> >>episode of the second season we know are "one and the same".
> >
> >Careful, George. Never take Lynch/Engels at face value.
> >"One and the same" does not necessarily mean "identical".
> >I really dounbt they meant that. Since Carel Struycken did
> >not appear in the movie we are left to ponder on that question,
> >but I think that if you refer to a person, say you or me, then
> >each of us is composed of different facets. Depending on our
> >mood and feelings we tend to show one (or a few) over others.
> >Yet they are all a part of a whole, hence "one and the same."
> >Lynch and co-writers may have well had the same in mind.

But in the movie the LMFAP says "I am the arm and I sound like this" (making
the indian whooping noise) and in the last episode of the second season
Senor Droolcup is sitting next to the LMFAP in the waiting room and makes
the whooping noise, gets up, says coffee..... to Cooper, turns into The Giant
whom sits down, looks at the LMFAP and says "one and the same". I think that

-=*George*=-
> >
> >



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In article <15559@umd5.umd.edu>, jblum@hamlet.umd.edu (Hi ho -- Kermit the Frog here...) writes...
> >In article <28325@twics.co.jp> joji@twics.co.jp writes:

>> >>Who was with Leo when Bobby and Mike ego to the woods to pick up the 
>> >>football of cocaine?  One of the Bernaud(sp) brothers? [early episode]

> >Good question, actually.  My money is on Dr. Jacoby, since we find out
> >later that he's been watching Leo.  The other popular theory is that it
> >is Jacques Renault, or maybe Bernie.

     My thought was always that it was Jawques -- someone standing
     behind Leo to imply someone BEHIND Leo -- a backer in the drug
     smuggling operations.  That someone is Jaques (who, I believe,
     "muled" the drugs over the border from his brother Jean to Leo
     who sold them to Bobby (and Laura, and sometimes Mike) to
     sell at school.)  


>> >>When Bob leaves Leland's body in that scene where the sprinklers come
>> >>on in the jail cell, why does Leland always say "They made me do it"?
>> >>Why doesn't he say 'He' made me do it, as in BOB?
> > 
> >Because back at the time when he killed Teresa, MIKE and BOB were still
> >partners.  We still don't know how / if Leland knew MIKE, or the one-armed
> >man.

     That's not right.  The One-Armed-Man says he was BOB's partner
     until he saw the Face of God and took off the arm -- he was
     already One-Armed when we see him in FWWM and nothing suggested
     he had JUST RECENTLY lost that arm...  

     Instead, I think Leland's dialogue in his death scene signifies
     only that there are more beings involved in it than just BOB:
     The LMFAP, the Tremonds/Chalfonts, probably the Giant as well...
     They have a larger motive than just thrills in feeding on the
     fear and suffering of victims. 

     In FWWM, the OAM says he had
     the creamed corn "canned above the convenience store" and that
     BOB stole it, and that "The thread will be torn" if BOB doesn't
     replace the corn he stole  -- which he does, with Laura's.
     That's why the OAM and LMFAP demand their share -- BOB must
     replace what he stole so they can go "can" it again.  
     This signifies the LMFAP and MIKE (and probably The Giant)
     have a longterm, higher goal -- 

     When they have enough Creamed Corn, strengthening the thread --
     although who knows what they are holding together with that
     thread -- the passage between two worlds moving apart, theirs
     and ours, perhaps -- they can "go home."  This last part is
     made clear in the script, but was cut from the final film.

     BOB, I'd argue, hordes the creamed corn for himself -- he's 
     addicted to it, as his victims are usually addicted to drugs.
     So he kills humans.  That makes the OAM a reformed alcaholic --
     he broke the addiction.

     Anyway, that's my two cents for now...  :-)


>> >>In the roadhouse, the night Maddy is killed, Donna is sitting in a both
>> >>with James.  The Giant tells Cooper that it is happening again.  He goes,
>> >>she starts crying.  Why?
> > 
> >Movie spoiler.  There are hints that Donna's sudden transformation from
> >nice-girl to weirdo is connected to something in the movie which begins at
> >the Roadhouse.  Maybe she too gets a sense that "it is happening again" --
> >that the process that corrupted Laura is happening to her.

> >Or maybe not.  It could just be that she's breaking down at the thought of
> >her part in Harold Smith's death.

     Or not...!  Um.  I agree that on one level, Donna is probably
     crying for Harold Smith - but TWIN Peaks usually operates on
     at least two levels.  James also looks stricken, and why would
     he be weeping for Harold?  He had very little to do with Donna
     and Maddy's plot - and he believes "it wasn't anybody's fault."
     I think Donna is stricken - as is James, but not as strongly -
     with the knowledge, not exactly that "It is happening again,"
     but that "Something horrible has happened..."  She has that
     sudden sick feeling you get when you suddenly become sure
     tragedy has befallen a member of the family.  

>> >>Also, Bobby has this remorseful look on his face.  Why?
> > 
> >I didn't see too much remorse -- I think he's looking at James and Donna
> >with a vague expression of cluelessness.  He doesn't know how James got away
>from the planted cocaine from before.  He also has completely missed
> >everything that just happened on-stage.

     This works on one level for Bobby -- except when you think,
     "Wouldn't he have known James was in school that whole
      week in between the cocaine thing and that night in the
      Roadhouse?"  

     Rather, I'd say Bobby's expression belies feelings which
     match Donna and James'.  These three were Laura's closest
     friends and lovers -- shouldn't they pick up some vibe of
     what The Giant communicated to Coop?  Not enough to have
     gleaned "It" was happening again -- but enough to know 
     something terrible happened?  

     I think that's definitely reasonable given that ANYONE
     specifically attuned can see these people.  Cooper is
     spectacularly intuned, to the point of Tibetan techniques.
     So are Major Briggs (Bobby's father, no less) and The Log
     Lady... 


>> >>Does anyone know if the Log Lady saw the Giant up on the stage.

> >No.  We don't know.

     Yes we do.  She saw the whole thing -- she's the most peacefully
     intuned to this shit in the whole town; she's survived exposure
     to the "Owls" (in the form of her husband and her log) and been
     left alone.
     She's moving during the visitation, and no one else in the
     Roadhouse is - that is, apart from Coop himself, who definitely
     saw it (duh).  She's looking at Cooper in a different way than
     Donna and James are looking at themselves -- as their looks,
     and Bobby's, are unknowing looks, the Log Lady's is a KNOWING
     one.  
     She's a savvy kind of lady, you know -- she knows what's what.


                 Shortly  thereafter, the health of  Annie
                 Blackburn still in question, the behavior
                 of Special Agent  Dale Cooper was noticed
                 __________________________to have changed.
                                              Scott Gorcey.            

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In article <5034@calmasd.Prime.COM> jpb@calmasd.Prime.COM (Jan Bielawski)
writes:
> >In article <1992Sep18.063753.16281@muddcs.claremont.edu<
wprice@pomona.claremont.edu writes:
> ><In FWWM, was the actress who appeared in Laura's bed really the same  
> ><actress who played Annie?  She looked terrible and quite different.  
> >
> >Funny.  I recognized her instantly, she looked to me identical
> >to Annie (except the wound), facial expressions, voice, everything.  Really.

Jan, so did I. I noticed Heather Graham's credit at the
beginning of the movie and her voice was the wispy voice
she has. 
> >
> ><And why is she in the Lodge?  I thought she was out.
> ><
> >Laura is dreaming and has a premonition of the future.  BTW, I don't
> >quite subscribe to the "time runs backward in the lodge" theory.  It is 
> >too smooth an explanation and reduces the events in TP to some sort of >Mickey
Mouse physics that only needs to be applied to straighten >everything up.
> >It seems to me some characters are able to "see" different "times" in
> >both "our world" and "the waiting room world" (or whatever it is) so these
> >visions appear all mixed up and frequently backwards.

Mickey Mouse theories aside, I think that the backwards stuff
doesn't quite fit together either. People who are _alive_ at the 
time of the vision have no idea at what time the vision is that
they are experiencing. Perhaps like a dream where we have no
idea of timeframes, i.e., in what relation the dream is to reality.
The ring scene with Coop and the MFAP could then be explained thusly:
The MFAP taunts Coop into confusing him on the time frame. We conclude
from the vision that it is the future since Coop is in the room and
Annie is present in her bloody condition.
Cooper realizes that it is Laura's vision and warns her not to jump
into receiving the ring too soon. Although we never see her actively
_refusing_ it. Therefore, the picture seems to have been a two-way
instrument: the old woman was able to influence Laura's vision
and show her the ring, and Laura was able to see the ring.

> >
> >Jan Bielawski
> >Computervision, San Diego
> >jpb@calmasd.prime.com
> >

There also may be some additional details about the rings.
There is one in Laura's vision, and it appears after the
grandson snaps his fingers, indicating perhaps that he is 
specially endowed into creating it. It is one ring of fire
that allows _outside_ access into the red room. Although
it may only occur in visions (I am going out on a limb on
this one). There is another one (from the original script)
in the room above the convenience store. Since we are left
to speculate whether this ring appears in a _real_ room or
not, I am assuming that the room is another type of waiting
room of the "Lodge" type. This would mean that the last ring,
the "scorched oil" ring in the forest is the only one to allow
access from the outside.



      UnoJ

 



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> >
> >Who was with Leo when Bobby and Mike ego to the woods to pick up the 
> >football of cocaine?  One of the Bernaud(sp) brothers? [early episode]

That was Dr. Jacoby.
> >
> >Did Donna, after Mrs. Tremond (middle-aged lady) gives her the letter
>from Harold, know that Leland is Laura's killer?  I get that impression,
> >because otherwise it doesn't explain why she went to their house to tell
> >Leland about the secret diary.
> >Also, didn't Harold kill himself the night after Donna and Maddy try to
> >take the diary.  How did he manage to mail that letter to Donna?
> >
 No, she went to ask about Maddy and happened to mention about the diary.
 The letter Harold sent Donna was sent the day before they recieved it so
 Harold had to mail it before he killed himself.

-=*George*=-



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In article <1992Sep18.201811.4077@intacc.uucp> zerobeat@intacc.uucp (Ferenc
Szabo) writes:
> >In article <190v4kINNi6h@bigboote.WPI.EDU> mking@wpi.WPI.EDU (Matthew
Alexander King) writes:
>> >>P.S.  Will someone please try and find out when the song "Sycamore Trees" 
>> >>is played during movie, oh and also check for what Laura was listening to
>> >>while doing coke, you know when see turns the radio on, thanks.
> >
> >
> >"Sycamore Trees" did not play in the movie. Note that the movie was edited
> >down to 135 minutes from 220 minutes(!!!!????!!!!)  I very glad they
> >decided to include the song anyway, since it's my favorite.

That's what I thought when I saw the movie for the first time.
"The song was too good to be left out from the soundtrack, so
they included it although it played only in one of the episodes"
Well, as it turned out, more careful ears listened to the movie.
Edwin Nomura from UCSD has put together a whole list of what
songs are played when in the movie, you should do well to check it
out. As I was saying, there is an instrumental portion of the
song "Sycamore Trees" that is played at least once: at the end
of the train car sequence the camera zooms on the tiles of the
Red Room. There the song is played.

> >
> >What song did Jimi Scott sing in the final episode?  Wasn't it an
> >excerpt from Sycamore Trees?

Right. The same exact song you now own on your soundtrack.
  
> >
> >ferenc
> >
 


       UnoJ





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In article <1992Sep18.201811.4077@intacc.uucp> zerobeat@intacc.uucp (Ferenc Szabo) writes:
> >In article <190v4kINNi6h@bigboote.WPI.EDU> mking@wpi.WPI.EDU (Matthew Alexander King) writes:
>> >>P.S.  Will someone please try and find out when the song "Sycamore Trees" 
>> >>is played during movie,
> >
> >"Sycamore Trees" did not play in the movie. Note that the movie was edited
> >down to 135 minutes from 220 minutes(!!!!????!!!!)  I very glad they
> >decided to include the song anyway, since it's my favorite.

It *did* play in the movie, though I think it was an instrumental version.
I remember quite clearly hearing it as Leland entered the circle of trees, 
right at the end. 

> >What song did Jimi Scott sing in the final episode?  Wasn't it an
> >excerpt from Sycamore Trees?  

Yes, it was. 

/Ola

--
Ola Torstensson, dat91oto@ludat.lth.se
No part of this article (including this .sig) should be taken seriously.

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In article <m7m7qB2w165w@zitt>, zitt!joe@dogface.austin.tx.us (Joe Zitt) says:
> >
> >adrian@cs.wm.edu (Adrian T. Filipi) writes:
> >
>> >> As a second part, I
>> >> believe the story of Windom Earle's involvement with the Lodge would prove
> >to
>> >> very interesting. Unfortunately I would not expect to see any more of Cooper
>> >> was seen in FWWM.
> >Pending, of course, K McL's wanting to continue, Windom Earle's story is quite
> >closely woven with Coop's; I would expect the story to run from WE's time in
> >Blue Book up until the death of Caroline.
> >
> >"Go to an extreme and then retreat to a more useful position"  --  Brian Eno
> >Joe Zitt               ...cs.utexas.edu!kvue!zitt!joe          (512)450-1916

For another film, I have to say that I really don't want to see the story of
WE and Cooper as detailed in The Tapes of Agent Cooper; undoubtedly, Lynch
would still keep a lot of stuff untold and secret, so the story probably
wouldn't go much farther than the Tapes book itself. An example of this would
be WE's mysterious "disappearances"; if Lynch & co. actually explained these
events in extreme detail, with a well-explored Lodge connection, they would be
worthwhile, but otherwise??? I mean, REITERATION of stuff we already know
about in some form ( like the diary ) is fun to watch but doesn't necessarily
justify making a whole new movie. What I'd LIKE to see would be a complete
continuation of the series from where it left off, or at least a film that
incorporated only really RELEVANT flashback sequences and that was mostly a
continuation.
                                              - T

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In article <15485@umd5.umd.edu>, jblum@hamlet.umd.edu (Hi ho -- Kermit the Frog
here...) says:
> >
> >In article <Buooqv.E6p@acsu.buffalo.edu> v075q5fr@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (ScottJ
> >Gorcey) writes:
>> >>     I was thinking of something even more elaborate: the sequel would
>> >>     be divided into thirds, like FWWM was (pre-editing, anyway).
> >
   Whatever happened to FWWM's proposed "final third"???? This was what I most
   wanted to see the movie for!!!!!!

>> >>     I. Project Bluebook -- Gordon Cole, Major Briggs and Windom
>> >>        Earle make an odd, ominous, discovery investigating the
>> >>        bizarre murder of a woman in Bend, Oregon... as the
>> >>        Nixon Administration, which doesn't believe in Little
>> >>        Green Men From Mars, breaks the Project apart...
> >
>> >>    II. Blue Rose (5 Years Later) -- Agent Phillip Jeffries investigates
>> >>        the disappearence in Missoula, Montana of an Agent named Judy,
>> >>        who, until now, had been Cole's top Blue Rose operative...
>> >>        Jeffries successfully (perhaps) infiltrates The Black Lodge
>> >>        and some of its secrets are laid before him... as he confronts
>> >>        the Evil Agent Cooper...

     Um...huh? What's the precedent for this? The GOOD coop is the one that's
     supposed to be in the lodge, and thus subject to Lodge/time travel; the
     evil Cooper exists as a separate entity only in the "future", and in
     physical (non-Lodge) form. Right?

> >minor point: Judy appears to actually be around at whatever time Jeffries
> >came from.  After all, she's "positive about this".

Well, "around" doesn't have to mean physically. What with all the Lodge stuff,
spirits, and time loops, etc. she could be dead...


>> >>   III. Dweller at the Threshold -- Cooper is revealed, as Cole joins
>> >>        forces with Major Briggs (and Hawk) to attempt a rescue of
>> >>        "The Good Dale."  The question of Annie Blackburn's health
>> >>        is answered satisfactorily... Briggs is killed heroically
>> >>        and afterwards, faces the biggest challenge of his "life..."
> >
>> >>     Or something like that...  How's that sound?
> >
> >Far too mainstream for Lynch.  Explains too much.  However... it would
> >make a BRILLIANT piece of fan fiction.  Or maybe even... dare we say?...
> >an independent novel.
> >

It seems like a lot of people assume the evil Dale will be "discovered" pretty
easily.... Why couldn't BOB play the part for the time being, waiting for
Cooper's position as a lawman to give him the opportunity to satisfy his
desires????

Another thing ( and also a little too mainstream.... ) : As a possible 'finale'
to the Lodge stuff, if it were ever accomplished, they should probably find a
way to rescue not only Cooper, but Desmond and Jeffries as well.....

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In article <19b5ilINN3ig@agate.berkeley.edu>, sally@anableps.berkeley.edu (S. A.
Wilson) says:
> >
> >In article <1992Sep17.115250.2668@pdn.paradyne.com> pitchon@paradyne.com      d
> >(Howar
> >Pitchon) writes:
> >>From Summer Storm:
>> >>
>> >>George, did I read correctly that you think Mrs. Tremond/Chalfont (sp?)
>> >>is one of the good guys? I guess that by steering Donna to Harold,
>> >>she helps solve the crime, but that ultimately leads to Annie and Coop
>> >>ending up in the lodge, and bashed in the face. Also, the picture that
>> >>she gives to Laura in FWWM doesn't exactly lead to pleasant dreams.
>> >>
>> >>You may be right, she may be a good entity, because... the road to hell
>> >>(the black lodge) may be paved w/good intentions.
>> >>
>> >>Just a thought.
>> >>
>> >>     ------ss
> >
> >
> >
> >Well, I think just because Mrs. Tremond/Chalfont did not "outright"
> >help/save Laura does not prove she is part of the "evil" entities,
> >but tends to make it more likely that she is part of the "good"
> >entities. I always thought that the inhabitants of the White Lodge
> >could not "outright" come to the aide of any of the terrestrial TPers,
> >that they could not interfer beyond a certain point in their lives. I think
> >that like the GIANT the Tremonds could not tell Laura directly about
> >BOB being in Leland, nor could they prevent her death, but could provide
> >vague clues, hints which were up to Laura to decipher and to use. It
> >was up to Laura to choose her own path, they could not get too involved
> >in this. Laura had to deal with her own demons, and Laura had to
> >confront her "shadow-self" and had to deal with it on her own. I am
> >not sure that, even though the picture was errie, they probably gave it
> >to her to get a vision of the lodges and from there she had to decide
> >for her self.  Again, maybe the dream/vision was like Coop's dream,
> >it held the clues and thus the answers, and it was up to Laura to
> >find that out for herself, and to use it as she liked.

Shouldn't we assume that all the characters depicted in the "filthy room" scene
in FWWM were evil, i.e. Black-Lodgers? If Mrs.Tremond was good in the series,
then maybe we have another doppleganger at work.......

> >Sally--any info. as to when the video version of FWWM will be coming out?
> >--
> >Video meliora proboque, deteriora sequor! ###   Sally   A.  Wilson
> >[Ovid's _Metaphorposes_]                  ###   sally@mica.berkeley.edu
> >Vita non est vivere sed valere vita est.  ###   P.  Spud  Peel
> >[Martial]                                 ###   [A member of Babble since 87]

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>>> >>>     I was thinking of something even more elaborate: the sequel would
>>> >>>     be divided into thirds, like FWWM was (pre-editing, anyway).

> >   Whatever happened to FWWM's proposed "final third"???? This was what I most
> >   wanted to see the movie for!!!!!!

     The "final third" takes place post-"How's Annie?"  so, if you
     watch the movie, you'll see that we DO see quite a bit of material
     from then: all the scenes with Cooper in the Lodge, for example,
     including Laura and the angel at the end.  
     It seems like Lynch decided to do something a little more - okay,
     a LOT - more elaborate with the final third -- he wove it 
     narratively into the rest of the film, using the time flow
     differences as his pretext.
     This is why Agent Jeffries can know about the Evil Coop although
     it's a year and a month BEFORE Coop's split.

     (Of course, those of us who've seen those famous slides of 
      Hawk in the Lodge and a funeral supposedly for Cooper with
      most of the cast in attendance...  Yes, it does suck that
      all this was cut...)

>>> >>>     I. Project Bluebook -- Gordon Cole, Major Briggs and Windom
>>> >>>        Earle make an odd, ominous, discovery investigating the
>>> >>>        bizarre murder of a woman in Bend, Oregon... as the
>>> >>>        Nixon Administration, which doesn't believe in Little
>>> >>>        Green Men From Mars, breaks the Project apart...
>> >>
>>> >>>    II. Blue Rose (5 Years Later) -- Agent Phillip Jeffries investigates
>>> >>>        the disappearence in Missoula, Montana of an Agent named Judy,
>>> >>>        who, until now, had been Cole's top Blue Rose operative...
>>> >>>        Jeffries successfully (perhaps) infiltrates The Black Lodge
>>> >>>        and some of its secrets are laid before him... as he confronts
>>> >>>        the Evil Agent Cooper...

> >     Um...huh? What's the precedent for this? The GOOD coop is the one that's
> >     supposed to be in the lodge, and thus subject to Lodge/time travel; the
> >     evil Cooper exists as a separate entity only in the "future", and in
> >     physical (non-Lodge) form. Right?

     Just because the good Coop is the one seemingly trapped in the Lodge
     doesn't mean Jeffries would never have encountered the evil-Cooper --
     why can't the Evil-Coop/BOB be in the Lodge periodically?  Perhaps
     BOB is doing "penance" for stealing the creamed corn from above
     the convenience store?  Perhaps he intends merely to gather the
     garmonbozia from humans now, instead of kill them for it all...
     Have LMFAP and the OAM reigned BOB in... for the time being?

     Anyway, whatever the reason, Jeffries clearly KNOWS what happened
     to Coop... and I think this suggests a major confrontation between
     Jeffries and Coop/BOB sometime in the future...  "...The later
     events have never been kept a secret..."

>>> >>>   III. Dweller at the Threshold -- Cooper is revealed, as Cole joins
>>> >>>        forces with Major Briggs (and Hawk) to attempt a rescue of
>>> >>>        "The Good Dale."  The question of Annie Blackburn's health
>>> >>>        is answered satisfactorily... Briggs is killed heroically
>>> >>>        and afterwards, faces the biggest challenge of his "life..."

>>> >>>     Or something like that...  How's that sound?

>> >>Far too mainstream for Lynch.  Explains too much.  However... it would
>> >>make a BRILLIANT piece of fan fiction.  Or maybe even... dare we say?...
>> >>an independent novel.

> >It seems like a lot of people assume the evil Dale will be "discovered" pretty
> >easily.... Why couldn't BOB play the part for the time being, waiting for
> >Cooper's position as a lawman to give him the opportunity to satisfy his
> >desires????

     I didn't attach a time-limit to how long BOB could get away with
     posing as Cooper...  Actually, I think the longer the better --
     but PEAKS isn't a series anymore, and the situation can't be
     thoroughly explored... it's a movie, and things must move
     and change...  
     Besides, don'tcha think Cole would know something was up?

> >Another thing ( and also a little too mainstream.... ) : As a possible 'finale'
> >to the Lodge stuff, if it were ever accomplished, they should probably find a
> >way to rescue not only Cooper, but Desmond and Jeffries as well.....

      God!  Please don't take this as a flame...  but this I'd expect
      to see only on the TWIN PEAKS CHILDREN'S CHRISTMAS SPECIAL.
      (Why does Jeffries need to be rescued?  Who cares about Desmond,
       really?  And, although Coop is our hero and narrator in Peaks,
       even he's not safe: we don't need him anymore, we know our
       way around Peaks just fine without him...  so...  my money
       is on the demise of all three, if anything...)


                 Shortly  thereafter, the health of  Annie
                 Blackburn still in question, the behavior
                 of Special Agent  Dale Cooper was noticed
                 __________________________to have changed.
                                              Scott Gorcey.            

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In article <2ABA9E53.23329@ics.uci.edu> bvickers@ics.uci.edu (Brett J. Vickers) writes:
> >Why not "Eye is
> >Windom Earle"?  Can anyone think of a significance for this?

It could be a variation of "arm is LMFAP."  Don't forget that Nadine
was missing an eye.  This sure sounds good, but I don't believe it for
a moment.

                            :: Jeff Makey

Department of Tautological Pleonasms and Superfluous Redundancies Department
    Domain: jeff@crash.cts.com    UUCP: nosc!crash!jeff

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I was wondering if someone could tell me how much 
the movie is making. How much total box office
earnings does it have and is it making less each
weekend or staying steady?

E-mail (and posting for any others who might be
interested) would be appreciated as I am avoiding
the group until I get a chance to see the movie
in order to avoid spoilers.

Thanks,

===============================================================================
Matt Brockman                                           mbrockma@ecn.purdue.edu
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    "While a llama may produce some of the world's finest of wools, prized
        around the world, their breath, on the other hand, could only 
            be prized somewhere in the far reaches of llama hell."
===============================================================================

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Well I have a Mac sitting here dying to have a copy of someone's
"Gramonbozia" sound on it.  Any kind soul out there send me a .hqx
file with "Garmonbozia" backwards and forwards?  so I can hear what
all the rage is about?  thanks.

I have no sound "recording" programs, but do have SoundMover and
with system7 can play SND resources.  thanks twice

.....................................  
-=====-                        -=====-                    
  -=-   exby@pogo.Colorado.EDU   -=-
   -                              -

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BTB, how did the film do in Europe and Japan? And since the film
still has not made it to Oz or NZ, where there is a fair following
it might make up for the US and Canada.

Sally--One last thing, is there a TP 1993 Calendar? I loved my 1992
TP calendar I would love to get a movie centered calendar for next
year--A. Wilson
-- Video meliora proboque, deteriora sequor! ### Sally A. Wilson [Ovid's _Metaphorposes_] ### sally@mica.berkeley.edu Vita non est vivere sed valere vita est. ### P. Spud Peel [Martial] ### [A member of Babble since 87]

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In article <1992Sep21.041402.6267@ucsu.Colorado.EDU> exby@pogo.Colorado.EDU (|J| Exby) writes:
> >
> >Well I have a Mac sitting here dying to have a copy of someone's
> >"Gramonbozia" sound on it.  Any kind soul out there send me a .hqx
> >file with "Garmonbozia" backwards and forwards?  so I can hear what
> >all the rage is about?  thanks.
> >
> >I have no sound "recording" programs, but do have SoundMover and
> >with system7 can play SND resources.  thanks twice
> >
> >.....................................  
> >-=====-                        -=====-                    
> >  -=-   exby@pogo.Colorado.EDU   -=-
> >   -                              -



Or can someone just upload and put it in the TP ftp site at audrey?
I sure would love a copy to add to all my TP sounds.

Thanks--


-- Video meliora proboque, deteriora sequor! ### Sally A. Wilson [Ovid's _Metaphorposes_] ### sally@mica.berkeley.edu Vita non est vivere sed valere vita est. ### P. Spud Peel [Martial] ### [A member of Babble since 87]

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The definition I found for 'boneless' is:
      1. A light beige color    OR
      2. A ghost like spirit of the night.

In response to a previous note:
I finally decided that the 'unknown character' at the drug-sale at the
end of episode 3 was either 'Bernard Renault' or the 'Grim Reaper' character.
Leo killed Bernard in episode 4 or 5.  If it was Bernard, his character is
dead in the series and we cannot ever know for sure.  


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 Here in Japan we have sometimes on TV the pilot episode of a series 
that is not being broadcasted as if it were a separate movie 
(we had The Flash pilot last saturday).

 Well, next Wednesday (Sept. 23) thet are showing TWIN PEAKS. I suppose
it will be the Euroversion, so at last i am going to see it.

Manuel
--
pece@taurus.cse.kyutech.ac.jp

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I know who Judy is. As there have been several references to cast
jokes. How about Judy Garland.
Coop: Garland, did Windom Earle do this to you?
MB: Garland? Odd name... Judy Garland?
Coop: Was it windom earle?
MB: It was God I suppose..

Ya know, mebbe Major Briggs is judy in the lodge.
(OK I Doubt it too, but then who is Judy)
--
===============================================================================
    "I was kind of dissapointed actually. I mean here he is the great and
    evil BOB and the worst thing he can do is squeeze a tube of toothpaste
                            out from the middle."
            -Something Someone Said About The Finale Of Twin Peaks
Matthew Frazer              |   Matthew Frazer    | But You Can Call Me 
Skidmore College            |   5 Stevens Way     |  mfrazer@skidmore.edu
Saratoga Springs NY 12866   |   Durham NH 03824   | 
===============================================================================
                              Be Seeing You!
===============================================================================


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Brett J. Vickers (bvickers@net3.ics.uci.edu) wrote:
: Someone else echoed what I had been thinking about when they
: said they would be more convinced if "I is Windom Earle" had
: something to do with eyes rather than "I".  Why not "Eye is
: Windom Earle"?  Can anyone think of a significance for this?
: 
: --
:  ___            _    _     _  _        _
: (  _) ___ ___ _( )__( )_  ( )( ) o  __( ) _  ___  ___  ___
: (___)(_) (__=) (_)_ (_)_   (__) (_)(_((_)(_'(__=)(_) _(_)
: Brett J. Vickers (bvickers@ics.uci.edu)
Garmonbozia, hm... in ordre to do the lodge scenes the actors
had to learn to speak their lines in reverse. Sooooo maybe Kenneth
Welsh just Garmonbozia Was One of his neat lines.

--
===============================================================================
    "I was kind of dissapointed actually. I mean here he is the great and
    evil BOB and the worst thing he can do is squeeze a tube of toothpaste
                            out from the middle."
            -Something Someone Said About The Finale Of Twin Peaks
Matthew Frazer              |   Matthew Frazer    | But You Can Call Me 
Skidmore College            |   5 Stevens Way     |  mfrazer@skidmore.edu
Saratoga Springs NY 12866   |   Durham NH 03824   | 
===============================================================================
                              Be Seeing You!
===============================================================================


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In article <37086@uflorida.cis.ufl.edu>, floyd@maple.circa.ufl.edu (FLOYD) writes:
> > In article <1992Sep13.123559.7497@ac.dal.ca>, 01sybok@ac.dal.ca writes:
>> >>Allright...here goes.
>> >>
>> >>I want to get another tattoo. For long while, I've been thinking about
>> >>
>> >>getting something Twin Peaks-esque.
>> >>
>> >>Finally it hit me... the perfect tattoo...
>> >>
>> >>I want to get the pertoglyph on Theresa Banks's ring!
>> >>
>> >>Even better... *ahem* my name is Mike, so I'm going to get it on my shoulder!
>> >>
> > 
> > 
> > Sorry about not mailing you concerning this.  Something wrong with my system
> > here.  Anyhow, Mike had his tatoo on his left arm.  As far as having a picture,
> > I don't have one.  Also, is there a background to the petroglyph?
> > 
Well... sorta. I am going to get it done with a green background, like the ring.
Mike, still looking for good oics of the petroglyph.

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In article <RJRcRB2w165w@netlink.cts.com>, jim@netlink.cts.com (Jim Bowery) writes:
> > tallman%ailanth.uucp@wang.com (Robert Oliver) writes:
> > 
>> >>  
>> >> Glastonbury is a small town in Somerset England. It is believed to be the 
>> >> site of Britain's first Christian community. Some tidbits about 
>> >> Glastonbury gleaned from the many tales of King Arthur:
>> >>  
>> >> 1. Lancelot's retreat

>> >> 2. Somehow associated with the Grail
It is sadi that Joseph of Aramathea buried the Grail at the foot of Glastonbury 
Tor.

>> >> 3. The burial site of Arthur (Cooper?)
Actually, it is equated in some legends with Avalon. According to the legends,
Aurthur isn't dead, but waiting until england is in its moment of greatest 
need...

Another interesting factoid I picked up was that Aurthur's realm was called
*ahem* Loges. Scary, huh?

All this stuff leads me to believe that maybe people are being nabbed so that
the will serve humanity in its hour of greatest need. Maybe Aurthur, and 
Churchill and (Fill in any number of other people) are being kept in 
"reserve" until they are needed. Coop and Annie, I would say, are more than
virtuous enough to qualify.
Extending the Aurthurian legend a little farthur, and mixing in a 
little Christianity, maybe the Lodge people are gearing up for Armageddon.
Perhaps Bob is grabbing Bad People (tm) (like Windom Earle), while the Dwarf
is grabbing Good People (like Coop and Annie). It's just a thought.

Mike

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I work at the local public radio station, and as such have access to lots o'
nifty high-tech audio equipment, so I tried the "garmonbozia- I is Windom
earle" thing on a Reel-to-reel, with splicing and at various speeds, and my
conclusion is:


They sound NOTHING like each other.

I tried again and again, with variations, but no dice.  Nice thought, though.


---KUVAMP

Gareth "myth-dispeller" Skarka

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In article <MJ1078.92Sep21162438@sol.taurus.cse.kyutech.ac.jp>
mj1078@taurus.cse.kyutech.ac.jp (mmanuel pece) writes:
> >
> >it will be the Euroversion, so at last i am going to see it.
> >
> >Manuel
> >--
> >pece@taurus.cse.kyutech.ac.jp
> >
What are the differences between the US/Euroversions of the
pilot?

Oliver
Oliver Gassner   PISTUD2@DKNKURZ1.BITNET OR pistud2@nyx.uni-konstanz.de
Snail:  Am Briel 51c,  D-7750 Konstanz , South-Germany, Earth
Aliases -- Relay-Bitnet: KRAUT  IRC: Kraut_II  MUDS etc.: "Hagen"

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Something I recently noted:  The large Northwest Coast Indian
murals on the walls of the Great Northern.  Isn't the two-
headed snake looking one, the symbol of Soul Catcher?  Northwest
indians state the symbol is for physical and mental well-being and
I believe the symbol is currently used at the Northwest Center for
Occupational Health and Safety at the University of Washington.

yet another random connection   M

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So have any of you out there seen "Bob Roberts" yet? It's gotta be the
most hysterical movie I've seen in a couple of years. Definitely "One to
Check Out"tm

BTW, Leland (or the guy who played him, Ray Wise if I remember
correctly) was perfect for the part of Bob Robert's media advisor. He's
just as passively psychotic as in TP..

Mike

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In article <1992Sep21.091035.43185@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu>,
kuvamp@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu wrote:
> > 
> > I work at the local public radio station, and as such have access to lots o'
> > nifty high-tech audio equipment, so I tried the "garmonbozia- I is Windom
> > earle" thing on a Reel-to-reel, with splicing and at various speeds, and my
> > conclusion is:
> > 
> > 
> > They sound NOTHING like each other.
> > 
> > I tried again and again, with variations, but no dice.  Nice thought, though.
> > 

Sorry, but you must have done something wrong or spoken improperly.
There is no exact equivalence (see my posts), but given the likelihood that
MFAP was reciting something that he heard played back to him backwards, we
wouldn't expect exact reversability.  I was a skeptic myself at first, but
experiments with MacRecorder have convinced me.  In particular, the 'Windom
Earle' part is too close to be a coincidence.

-Rich

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I was just in the UK this summer and happened to climb Glastonbury Tor.
It was a very Erie place indeed.  Can't say that I saw BoB there though :)

--
   The opinions expressed are not necessarily those of the University of
     North Carolina at Chapel Hill, the Campus Office for Information
        Technology, or the Experimental Bulletin Board Service.
           internet:  bbs.oit.unc.edu or 152.2.22.80

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In article <BuwBoz.M9p@acsu.buffalo.edu> v075q5fr@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Scott J Gorcey) writes:

> >     (Of course, those of us who've seen those famous slides of 
> >      Hawk in the Lodge and a funeral supposedly for Cooper with
> >      most of the cast in attendance...  Yes, it does suck that
> >      all this was cut...)

Was it ever shot?  I thought it turned out that all the funeral slides
were a hoax, shot on-set during the making of #1003 at Laura's funeral.
Hence the reported presence of Audrey.

>> >>to the Lodge stuff, if it were ever accomplished, they should probably find a
>> >>way to rescue not only Cooper, but Desmond and Jeffries as well.....

> >      God!  Please don't take this as a flame...  but this I'd expect
> >      to see only on the TWIN PEAKS CHILDREN'S CHRISTMAS SPECIAL.
> >      (Why does Jeffries need to be rescued?  Who cares about Desmond,
> >       really?  And, although Coop is our hero and narrator in Peaks,
> >       even he's not safe: we don't need him anymore, we know our
> >       way around Peaks just fine without him...  so...  my money
> >       is on the demise of all three, if anything...)

I don't think ALL of them would be trashed.  After all, we need someone
to explain (or at least hint) at more of what's going on in the Lodge.
Chester Desmond is probably the most likely to survive -- after all,
his main reason for being in FWWM is as a substitute Coop.  (I get the
feeling that if Kyle had been more available / willing, he would have
investigated Teresa Banks like he did in the Autobiography.)

On the other hand...  Coop must DIE.  For several reasons.  Kyle's
reluctance to continue is the least of them.  Another one is Jean
Renault's speech about how Coop brought the nightmare with him to
Twin Peaks -- and maybe, if he will die, the nightmare will end.  Most
important, though, is the fact that Leland died, and Twin Peaks is
cyclical.  If there is to be a final confrontation between MIKE and BOB,
we know it will end with BOB getting shot, as in the dream sequence...
and that doesn't bode well for Coop.

Besides, it's just such a neat image for the end of the film for Coop
to be in the chair in the red room, this time with Laura as his guardian /
angel.

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First: While we are all entitled to our opinions, "Garmonbozia",
in mine, DOES reverse to "I is Windom Earle". I think I've been pretty much
fanatic on that point.
Second: Sorry to those who got a little offended at the way I
disagreed with them on this point. I was a little excited. I'm sorry, I
didn't mean to be an asshole.

-Jeff

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     Coop, Desmond and Jeffries must die...

> >I don't think ALL of them would be trashed.  After all, we need someone
> >to explain (or at least hint) at more of what's going on in the Lodge.
> >Chester Desmond is probably the most likely to survive -- after all,
> >his main reason for being in FWWM is as a substitute Coop.  (I get the
> >feeling that if Kyle had been more available / willing, he would have
> >investigated Teresa Banks like he did in the Autobiography.)

     I get that feeling too... but Desmond's presence may have
     worked to the film's advantage - to suggest, as with Blue
     Rose, a wider, more formal investigation by Cole into
     what's up in those Douglas Firs...  and Sycamores, for
     that matter...

     However, my point was: Coop CAN die now, because we don't
     NEED a narrator anymore.  For several reasons: first,
     a film has wider breadth of narration in and of itself;
     especially a Lynch film.  Second, we have a workable
     knowledge base of the backstory - perhaps it is still
     harder, but in the end much more rewarding, if we are
     forced to work through it ourselves.  And third, of
     course, these people have a very high mortality rate:
     Coop MUST die because he CAN die.

> >On the other hand...  Coop must DIE.  For several reasons.  Kyle's
> >reluctance to continue is the least of them.  Another one is Jean
> >Renault's speech about how Coop brought the nightmare with him to
> >Twin Peaks -- and maybe, if he will die, the nightmare will end.

     I'd take issue briefly with that: Josie says similar.  The
     truth of it is, Coop didn't BRING the nightmare.  He
     brought it OUT into the open.  Before Coop, the weirdness
     in Twin Peaks - and Bend, Oregon, and Deer Meadow WA and
     Missoula Montana, etc - was simply not spoken of: like
     adultery in the 50s -- which contributed to the anachronistic
     feel of the series.

  Most
> >important, though, is the fact that Leland died, and Twin Peaks is
> >cyclical.  If there is to be a final confrontation between MIKE and BOB,
> >we know it will end with BOB getting shot, as in the dream sequence...
> >and that doesn't bode well for Coop.

     When did BOB get shot in the dream?  In the Euroversion, you
     mean?  I wouldn't go by that, myself... 

     But: I don't see the grand scheme of Peaks mythology as
     simply as a confrontation between MIKE and BOB.  

     These beings are from somewhere else - I don't want to
     say another planet, that's stupid, it smacks too much of
     Rocky Horror -- but they're from somewhere else, and they're
     clearly stranded here.  At least, FWWM makes that clear (the
     script makes it even more clear).

     The "fuel" they need to get home is distilled from the 
     fear and suffering of humans: FIRE distilled to Garmonbozia
     distilled further to Creamed Corn.  MIKE and the LMFAP (who
     were once one entity) and other residents of The Lodge
     like The Giant inhabbit humans - perhaps even with those
     humans' approval - and collect the ambient fear and
     suffering we all feel daily.  
     BOB, at some point, stopped collecting ambient fear and
     suffering and started CAUSING it.  This indicates that
     FIRE is addictive to the one who consumes it.  BOB is
     an addict - he stole the creamed corn MIKE had "canned"
     above the convenience store.
     If he doesn't return it, the "thread" (the link to that other
     place they want to get back to) will be "torn" and they'll
     be stuck here forever.  
     So BOB must give MIKE and LMFAP "their share" of FIRE after
     killing Laura and taking hers: because he owes it to them.
     In the script, LMFAP tells BOB: "You're not going home without
     me" just before he demands his (and MIKE's) share of the
     FIRE.
     This explains MIKE's behavior too.  MIKE is also addicted
     to the FIRE.  But he "saw the face of God" and "took off
     the arm" -- so he's a reformed alcaholic.  

     I think this has the ring of possibility -- what does everyone
     else think?  I'd love some feedback!

> >Besides, it's just such a neat image for the end of the film for Coop
> >to be in the chair in the red room, this time with Laura as his guardian /
> >angel.

     But is Laura still in The Lodge?  (She was in the Lodge 25
     years later... but she wasn't Laura, she was LMFAP's "cousin"
     then - same Laura?  Dunno...)  I thought she was saved by
     that angel - and perhaps taken to The White Lodge?

                 Shortly  thereafter, the health of  Annie
                 Blackburn still in question, the behavior
                 of Special Agent  Dale Cooper was noticed
                 __________________________to have changed.
                                              Scott Gorcey.            

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I think that seeing Laura Palmer as a Dorothy character is a keen observation. 
If one considers the kind of "Wizard of Oz" imagery that Lynch was playing with
in "Wild at Heart," it would seem to make sense to view Laura in this manner.

Peace,
John Phythyon, Jr.

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This is a brief list of what is available on the anonymous FTP site at the
University of South Australia.  The address of the Site is:

  audrey.levels.unisa.edu.au [130.220.16.88]   directory  /twin-peaks 

By the way, the machine 'audrey' WAS named after the character in TP.  It is
NOT a coincidence, whatever you may think :-)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
In response to lots of questions, here's the pocket tutorial on how to use
anonymous FTP from the 'cribsheet'.

Start up FTP and at its prompt ("ftp>") say "open 130.220.16.88" . If you
connect successfully you'll be asked for name and password. For name say
"anonymous" and for password use your net address, e.g. I would type
"peter@audrey.levels.unisa.edu.au"
  
Now, say "cd /twin-peaks" . FTP has help (for most implementations you
type "?" or "h"), but the commands you need are these:
  
  ls          brief listing
  dir         long listing
  cd          change directory on the remote machine
  lcd         change directory on your local machine
  get <name>  copy a remote file <name> to the current directory on
               your local disk
  binary      need to say this for other than text files (FTP responds,
               mysteriously, "Mode set to I")
  quit        close connection and exit

That's it, enjoy. The large world of anonymous FTP is now open to you.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

======================
Lists and Compilations
======================

- Annotated timeline for TP episodes broadcast to date as well 
   as the movie Fire Walk With me.
    (Ascii as well as version Formatted for MS Word v4.0 in RTF 
     [Rich Text Format] suitable for both Dos and Macintosh Computers)
- TP cast to date
- Credits for each episode
- Answers to frequently asked questions
- Compilation of favorite quotes
- Cribsheet to TP resources
- Symbols/motifs in the Twin Peaks Universe
- Oeuvres of TP contributors
    (all movies/books each artist has been associated with)

==================
Other TP Resources
==================

GIFS:

There are four sets of Gifs -

Greyscale  from episode 2001:
albert.gif      blackie.gif     gi_and_c.gif    jerry2.gif      ronette1.gif
audrey1.gif     bob.gif         giant1.gif      laura1.gif      ronette2.gif
audrey2.gif     coop_har.gif    giant2.gif      laura2.gif      ronette3.gif
audrey3.gif     coopdoc.gif     giant3.gif      leland.gif      sar_madd.gif
audrey4.gif     cooper1.gif     great_no.gif    lelsarma.gif    sarah.gif
audrey5.gif     cooper2.gif     hank_ben.gif    maddy1.gif      saw.gif
audrey6.gif     deadlaur.gif    hospital.gif    maddy2.gif      shelley.gif
ben_jerr.gif    donna.gif       jer_lel_.gif    maddy3.gif      title.gif
bird.gif        droolcup.gif    jerry1.gif      mill.gif

Full color from episode 2007:
arrest.gif          commbreak.gif       horse.gif           norma.gif
audrey.gif          cooper.gif          laura.gif           shelly.gif
audrey2.gif         cruise.gif          laura_bw.gif        sherrif.gif
ben_and_audrey.gif  diary.gif           leo.gif             waterfall.gif
bob.gif             finger.gif          mikediscussion.gif
bobby.gif           giant.gif           murder.gif
cafe.gif            harold.gif          nadine.gif

Full color from episode  2008:
BOB2.gif            maddy.gif
cooper-diane.gif    jerry.gif           normas_parents.gif
diane.gif           lynch-frost.gif

Excerpt from Sherilyn Fenn's Playboy pictorial:
Sherilyn.gif
fenn1.gif 
fenn2.gif


SOUNDS:

Far too many sounds to list here, in both Sun uLaw and MacRecorder
formats.  Also included in the archive is a player for the Mac Sounds,
as well as a converter from Mac to Sun format.

HYPERCARD STACKS:

There are now three stacks TPBSCompanion, TPstack and TwinPeaksTrivia.  The
TPstack is basically a collection of sounds with its own player, while the
TPBSCompanion illustrates the relationship between characters and gives 
details on each person.  TwinPeaksTrivia is exactly that; trivia about
twin-peaks - either test yourelf with a quiz or browse through the
information.

There's a lot more information in the README files scattered throughout
the archive.  If you need some help don't hesitate to send me mail.

Peter Asenstorfer,
Twin-Peaks FTP site administratior.
<peter@audrey.Levels.UniSA.Edu.Au>
#! rnews 321
Path: levels!etpma
From: etpma@levels.unisa.edu.au
Newsgroups: alt.tv.twin-peaks
Subject: cancel <18739.2ab9e898@levels.unisa.edu.au>
Message-ID: <18765.2abeed0f@levels.unisa.edu.au>
Date: 22 Sep 92 09:53:19 +0930
Control: cancel <18739.2ab9e898@levels.unisa.edu.au>
Lines: 1

cancel <18739.2ab9e898@levels.unisa.edu.au>
#! rnews 5341
Path: levels!9051467f
From: 9051467f@levels.unisa.edu.au (Wild Child)
Newsgroups: talk.origins
Subject: Re: Atheistic creationism -- a tutorial
Message-ID: <18766.2abeeef2@levels.unisa.edu.au>
Date: 22 Sep 92 10:01:22 +0930
References: <1992Sep21.073921.13481@smds.com>
Organization: University of South Australia
Lines: 93

In article <1992Sep21.073921.13481@smds.com>, rh@smds.com (Richard Harter) writes:

> > the thesis of evolution as historical fact, i.e. the common descent of

I don't know about other people, but I have NEVER thought that all life on
this planet could traced back to a single life form.

> > To be fair [we atheistic creationists are notoriously fair] this is not
> > the real line of argument.  The real line is that evolution, the historical
> > "fact", was established by other arguments; in turn the indicated method
> > was genetic change.  It is the evidence and arguments for historical
> > evolution that we address and refute.
> > 
> > Now consider selection.  We contend that selection cannot produce the
> > results claimed for it.  The principle argument is that life forms are
> > already adapted to their environmental niches.  The claim is that changes
> > in the environment change fitness, which in turn leads to selection for

Consider deer versus lion. A strain of deer runs faster than the rest and
hence this strain's percentage of makeup increases. Next, a strain
of lion runs faster so they get more of the deer that run faster and hence
their percentage in the makeup increases. After a while, only the fast deers
and lions can survive and the whole process starts again.
IMO, there is no such thing as perfect fitness.

Kinda like positive feedback in closed systems, huh? Well, not closed, the
whole thing is being powered on by sunlight making greens grow which feed the
deers and so on.

> > What about mutation, that marvelous engine of new genetic variation?
> > The problem is that the life process is interlocked; it is easy to
> > produce neutral or deleterious mutations.  Deleterious mutations are
> > eliminated quickly [selection to the norm].  Neutral mutations are not
> > but that doesn't matter -- they do not have phenotypic signifigance.
> > Advantageous mutations of phenotypic signifigance have no signifigant
> > probability of occuring because they must be coordinated changes.  In
> > other words it does not suffice to change a single gene; several must
> > be changed at once.  The odds against multiple, simulataneous changes
> > are very long indeed.

You don't seem to comprehend the sheer amount of time involved, nor
can you see the easy situations in which multiple mutations can occur.

Take for example some sort of low lying creature, like a rabbit or
small dog. Wanders off into an area in which there are some large
radioactive rocks (usually UO2 or something), and takes a leak on one.
Bingo! An easy, credible situation in which these multiple mutations can
take place.
(Such radioactive rocks lying on the surface DO exist, even today. A few
billion years ago, they'd be more radioactive then they are now).

There is also the possibility of a chemical attack, such as an animal
falling into a tar pit, having some strange chemicals enter the body
and the animal is lucky enough to get out alive and later mates etc.

And what of synergy? A mutation in an ancestor does nothing, a different
mutation in another ancestor does nothing but if the two mate and
the offspring has both resulting in a useful mutation, then that could
be considered a multiple mutation couldn't it?

> > The major difference between spontaneous creation of genetic information
> > (SCGI) and mutation is that SCGI has no signifigant probability of
> > occurring randomly.  In addition SCGI can occur in more than one individual
> > at the same time in a given population in a localized area.  [How else
> > to account for speciation?]  This accounts for meaningful phenotypic
> > transitions in descent lines.  In addition it is clear that SCGI events
> > can bring new descent lines into being.  Clearly abiogenesis was an SCGI
> > event; if one can occur then so can more.  If this is the case then what
> > we are observing in life today is multiple descent lines.  The common
> > features of life that are advanced as evidence for common descent can
> > equally well be read as evidence that certain types of SCGI events are
> > favored over others.

So, at one time in the VERY distant past, some chemicals in the primeordial
sea came together in the right amounts and the right reactions took place?
The different descent lines show that different sets of reactions took
place in different parts of the world. For example, are those sulfur eaters
at the bottom of the pacific any relation to landwalkers?

If this is what you are saying then I agree, and I think that's what
other evolutionists say. If not, could you explain this SCGI part a bit
more?

As you can tell from the sig, I'm not well read on either but I know
the basics, which sounds a damnsight more plausible than a week long
project by some deity.

-- John McVey, Whyalla, Uni S.Aust 9051467f@levels.unisa.edu.au Electronic Engineering Student & Terror Tekkie G1 (at 19!) +------------------------------------------------------+ --| Obligatory disclaimer : UniSA hates my opinions... |-- +------------------------------------------------------+

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> > I think that seeing Laura Palmer as a Dorothy character is a keen observation.
> > If one considers the kind of "Wizard of Oz" imagery that Lynch was playing
> > within "Wild at Heart," it would seem to make sense to view Laura in this
> > manner.

> > Peace,
> >John Phythyon, Jr.

As long as we're going along those lines, this summer, I wrote a critical
analysis of Blue Velvet for my Intro to Cinema class, and in doing some
research, I came across an article in "Literature/Film Quarterly".  I can't
remember the date, but I think it was Fall '85.

Anyhow, the whole issue had Blue Velvet papers in it, and one of them focused
on how Lynch parallels the Blue Velvet story to "The Wizard of Oz".

Dan Langrill
dlangril@mozart.helios.nd.edu
--


******
            | "Through the darkness, a future past,

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Ciao,

Way back in when I saw the last episode (2022) in the scene in
the Lodge when SDC does his little Indian whoop and shouts Hallelujah
I thought that this was in fact another allusion inside joke regarding
the actor who played SDC. It has been bugging me ever since, and ever
since I wanted to post my idea of this to the net but was too
embarrassed. Now, I thought this was an inside joke referring to
a character that the actor played in a John Wayne western.  I am 
uncertain about my memory, but I vaguely remember that in this flick
the actor played this guy was somewhat touched mentally due to
some Indian attack which occurred in his past. He always babbled about
wanting a rocking chair, and in the end of the flick we see him on
a porch in his newly acquired rocking chair. Also, if I remember 
correctly he repeated the "Hallelujah" throughout the flick, or
at least in this final scene of the picture. Now, I also believe
that he would come out with an Indian whooping sound occasionally
as well.

Now, I might be completely wrong, but I seem to think I am not.
While going over the Allusions file I did not notice this reference.

I have heard that the guy who plays SDC was in a number if not all
of John Wayne's westerns....

Anyway, I finally had the courage to pass this on to the net. Flame
if you like. I sure would like this either confirmed or denied for
my personal peace of mind.

Sally--
-- Video meliora proboque, deteriora sequor! ### Sally A. Wilson [Ovid's _Metaphorposes_] ### sally@mica.berkeley.edu Vita non est vivere sed valere vita est. ### P. Spud Peel [Martial] ### [A member of Babble since 87]

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I only have 2 of the 6 episodes of On the Air taped.  I'd like to
know if there is any way I can get all 6.

--                    
INTERNET:  jim@netlink.cts.com (Jim Bowery)
UUCP:   ...!ryptyde!netlink!jim
NetLink Online Communications * Public Access in San Diego, CA (619) 453-1115

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In article <1992Sep19.182524.20360@exu.ericsson.se>,
exurobv@exu.ericsson.se (Robert Virden) wrote:
> > 

> > at HIM, wondering what in the hell was going on.  As Stanton, tried to snap out of
> > it, he started looking like he was going to cry.  And what were the first things
> > he said?
> > 
> > "I've already been places.  I just want to stay right here, now" {close enough}
> > 
> > I interpret that to mean that Stanton also has had some kind of contact with the
> > lodge. The Chalfonts' didn't seem to mean anything special to him, but he freaked
> > out over the ice-pack woman.
> > 
> > What does everyone else make of this?

I interpret it the same way you do, namely, that Rodd (Stanton) has had
some sort of contact with whatever forces are behind the displacements. 
Alternatively, it could be a red herring and he is just psychic and is
speaking of conventional travels of his own in the past, rather than
'special' travel.

-Rich

> > 
> > -Trebor

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I know this is a bit off the subject, but I couldn't resist.

Last weekend the film Barbarella was shown on British TV.  My local
paper, the Brighton Evening Argus, claimed that Roger Vadim wants to
remake the film with Sherilyn Fenn in the title role.

Can this be true?  The mind, as they say, boggles.  I wonder how Lynch
might direct this one, given the chance?

Graham

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From the 1997 Trivial Pursuit(tm) 'Silver Screen' Edition:

Q: What actor from a popular television series set in a quirky and
ominous small Northwestern town played a young Robert Redford in
this 1992 hi-tech adventure film about hackers?

A: Gary Hershberger played both Mike "Snake" Nelson, Bobby Briggs'
best friend and Donna Hayward's ex-boyfriend, in _/\ Twin Peaks /\_,
and, with a startling resemblance, a young Robert Redford in the
prologue of the film "Sneakers."


/^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^\
`Christopher T. Spring Dangerous objects were left about in the hope
`spring@helios.ece.arizona.edu that it would do itself an injury, preferably
`University of Arizona fatal. But it never did.
- Edward Gorey - "The Beastly Baby"
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While perusing Gareth Knight's _The Secret Tradition in Arthurian Legend_ for
non-Twin Peaks reasons, I came across a passage I thought I'd pass along (in
light of the discussion of the significance of Glastonbury/Glastonbury Grove).  

 "...it is not with the mysteries of the astral world that Merlin and
[the Lady of the Lake] are concerned when they...prophecy what is 
going to happen to Britain.  They are intent upon bringing through
high[er planes] spiritual forces to the earth plane.  This is a 
function of the archetypal white magician and of that inner body of
them known in esoteric primers as the Great White Lodge."

Thought some of you might be interested -

Holly

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Sad but true: There won't be any more new Twin Peaks films :-(
This is a text I found in a movie-magazin (cinema [europe], 8/92).
It's a guest comment David Lynch wrote. 
I tried to translate it:
 
 D A V I D   L Y N C H - Gastkommentar
 -------------------------------------
 
Auf dem Festival von Cannes wurde mir   % At the festival in Cannes I was asked
immer wieder dieselbe Frage gestellt:% the same question over and over 
'Warum haben Sie "Twin Peaks - Fire Walk% again: 'Why did you shoot "Twin Peaks
With Me" gedreht?' Ist das nicht bloss  % Fire Walk With Me"?' Isn't that just 
ein Aufguss der Fernsehserie? Ein Plagi-% a rehash of the tv series? A plagia-
at in eigener Sache? Darauf moechte ich % rism on one's own account? I'd like 
zweierlei erwidern: Zunaechst einmal ist% to answer in two ways: First of all  
der Film mein Kirschkuchen-Geschenk fuer% is the movie my cherrypie-present for
die Fans der Serie - allerdings eines,  % the fans of the series - but one that
das in Stacheldraht verpackt ist. Zum   % is wrapped in barbed wire. On the  
anderen sind mir die Figuren der Serie  % other hand, the characters of the se-
einfach ans Herz gewachsen. Ich hatte   % ries are very dear to me. I wanted to
Lust, noch einmal symbolisch von ihnen  % say symbolically goodbye to them once
Abschied zu nehmen. Mir wurde instinktiv% more. Instinctively I realised that
klar, dass die Geschichte von Laura Pal-% the story of Laura Palmer wasn't told
mer noch nicht restlos zu Ende erzaehlt % to the end entirely. As a corpse 
war. Als Wasserleiche gab sie der Serie % found in water, she gave the series
ihren inneren Antrieb. Ich wollte sie   % it's inner drive. I wanted to reani-
noch einmal zum Leben erwecken, sie     % mate her once again, hear her tal-
sprechen hoeren, sich bewegen sehen.    % king, watch her moving. But to pre-
Aber um allen Irrtuemern vorzubeugen: Es% vent all errors: There won't be no
wird keine weiteren "Twin Peaks"-Folgen % more "Twin Peaks" - episodes, this 
geben, dies ist das Ende.               % is the end.
                                       :-(
                                        %  
Twin Peaks ist ein sehr geheimnisvoller % Twin Peaks is a very myterious place.
Ort. Er versetzt mich in einen Zustand  % It puts me in a position of dreaming.
des Traeumens. In dunkle Traeume. Ich   % Dreaming dark dreams. I like the 
mag die Strassen, die Gebaeude, die     % streets, the buildings, the atmos-
kleinstaedtische Atmosphaere und die na-% phere of a small town and the near
hen Waelder. Schon "Blue Velvet" haette % woods. Where we settled our fictiti-
ich am liebsten in der Gegend gedreht,  % ous small town Twin Peaks, was alrea-
in der wir spaeter unser fiktives Staed-% dy my favourite area for the shooting
chen Twin Peaks ansiedelten. Die Orts-  % of "Blue Velvet". The choice of place
wahl scheiterte damals am Einspruch     % failed then because of my producers 
meines Produzenten Dino De Laurentiis.  % Dino De Laurentiis' objection.
                                        %
"TWIN PEAKS - FIRE WALK WITH ME" ent-   % "TWIN PEAKS - FIRE WALK WITH ME" de-
schluesselt einige Geheimnisse der      % ciphers some secrets of the series, 
Serie, aber keineswegs alle. Einige     % but by no means all of them. Some 
Raetsel bleiben erhalten. Ich mag Filme % riddles stay preserved. I don't like
nicht, die alle Fragen beantworten. Die % movies that answer all the questions.
letzte Filmspule soll in der Phantasie  % The last reel of film should run in 
des Zuschauers ablaufen.                % the fantasy of the viewer.
                                        %
Deshalb lehne ich es auch grundsaetzlich% That's why I refuse to interpret se- 
ab, einzelne Elemente oder Motive meiner% parate elements or motives of my mo- 
Filme zu interpretieren. Alle wollen    % vies in principle. Everyone wants to
wissen, wofuer der "rote Raum" in "Twin % know, what the "red room" in "Twin
Peaks" steht, der auch im Film wieder   % Peaks" stands for, which also appears
auftaucht. Ich weiss es selbst nicht so % in the movie again. I don't know that 
genau. Ich kann mich noch gut erinnern, % exactly myself. I can remeber well, 
wann mir diese Idee kam, aber ich weiss % when I had this idea, but I don't 
nicht, warum. Vom rationalen Standpunkt % know, why. Looking at it from a ra-
aus betrachtet, weiss ich, dass ich ein % tional point of view, I know having 
aehnliches Muster wie das auf dem Boden % used a similar pattern like that on 
schon einmal in "Eraserhead" benutzte.  % the floor in "Eraserhead" before. 
Alles andere jedoch war eine reine Frage% All the other, however, was a pure  
der Eingebung: die roten Vorhaenge, das % question of inspiration: the red cur-
stilisierte Design, der tanzende Zwerg. % tains, the stylized design, the dan-
Selbst wenn ich wollte, koennte ich     % cing dwarf. Even if I wanted to, I 
nicht erklaeren, was sie bedeuten, denn % couldn't describe, what they mean, 
Intuition ist irrational. Der Unter-    % for intuition is irrational. The dif-
schied zwischen Realitaet und Phantasie % ference between reality and fantasy
war mir ohnehin noch nie richtig klar.  % has never been clear to me anyway. 
Wahrscheinlich werde ich sehr ueber-    % I'll probably be very surprised, when
rascht sein, wenn ich eines Tages       % I find out, what it really is, some
herausfinde, worin er besteht.          % day.
                                        %
Die gesamte "Twin Peaks"-Serie waere    % The whole "Twin Peaks"-series would
nicht moeglich gewesen ohne das Vertrau-% not have been possible without the
en in die Kraft des Unterbewussten. Ich % confidence in the power of the sub-
zeige in meinen Filmen Gedanken und Si- % conscious. In my films, I show 
tuationen, die mich beschaeftigen. Und  % thoughts and situations, that occupy
mich interessiert am meisten die dunkle % me. And I'm mainly interested in the
Seite des Lebens, das Ungewisse, das Er-% dark side of life, the uncertain, the
schreckende. Das fuehrt automatisch zum % frightening. This leads automatically
Reizthema Gewalt. Ich kann die staen-   % to the provoking subject 'violence'. 
digen Streitereien ueber die angebliche % I'm tired of the permanent arguing 
Brutalitaet meiner Filme bald nicht mehr% about the so-called brutality of my  
hoeren. Gewalt existiert nun mal in un- % movies. In our world, the Violence 
serer Welt und laesst sich nicht wegre- % simply exists and can't be talked 
den. Man muss sie zeigen, erst recht,   % away. One has to show it, especially
wenn man wie ich kraftvolle Geschichten % if you want to tell powerful stories
erzaehlen moechte. Das Kino ist ein re- % like I do. Cinema is a relatively 
lativ sicherer Ort, um sich mit Gewalt  % safe place to have a critical look at
zu beschaeftigen. Wer nur ueber die     % violence. Who wants to tell about the
Freude des Daseins und die Kunst des    % pleasure of existence only and the 
Kirschenpflueckens erzaehlen will, der  % art of picking cherries, shouldn't
soll erst gar keine Filme drehen. Denn  % make any films at all. Because good 
gute Menschen sind langweilig. Nur die  % people are boring. Only the evil have
boesen haben Stil.                      % style.
                                        %
Deshalb richtet sich "Twin Peaks - Fire % Therefore "Twin Peaks - Fire Walk 
Walk With Me" in erster Linie an solche % With Me" is first of all for such ci-
Zuschauer, die ein Gespuer fuer makabren% nemagoers, who have a sense for maca-
Humor und grotesken Surrealismus haben. % bre humour and grotesque surrealism.
Um den Film zu verstehen, ist es nicht  % It is not necessary to know all the
zwingend erforderlich, saemtliche Episo-% episodes of the tv series to under-
den der Fernsehserie zu kennen. Sicher, % stand the film. Sure, it would be
es waere von Vorteil, aber die Story ist% advantageous, but the story is build
so aufgebaut, dass man auch ohne Vorwis-% up in a way that you can quickly slip
sen schnell hineinrutscht. Twin Peaks   % into it, even without previous know-
ist naemlich ueberall. Es ist kein Ort. % ledge. Twin Peaks is everywhere you 
Es ist ein Zustand.                     % see. It is no place. It's a state.
                                        %
                                   David Lynch


Robert Michl

(rmichl@iiic.ethz.ch)

*****************************************************************
->My mother's name is Margaret (like the log Lady)
->We call Dad Carl (that was Fat Trout Trailer Park Guard)
->He's a Twin
->My brother's called Dennis (remember Denise Bryson?)
->We're Twins
->I'm BOB
->and my sister - guess what ? - Laura!
Well, the last names have been changed to protect the innocent...
*****************************************************************


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Kind of gross, but my theory on the Great Went is that Jacques meant that he already "came" as in sexually.  This would also explain the "blank" part. (Though not the gun motion or the fart reference.)


Internet address: Floyd@ufcc.ufl.edu
Bitnet address  : Floyd@ufcc
All opinions expressed are my own or mine.

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jim@netlink.cts.com (Jim Bowery) writes:

> >I only have 2 of the 6 episodes of On the Air taped.  I'd like to
> >know if there is any way I can get all 6.

There were 6??!?!  I thought that only 3 of them aired.  Am I wrong?
 
If so, I'd like to get the other 3!
 
...e

--
Ed Stastny           *  SOUND News and Arts magazine available now via
ed@cwis.unomaha.edu  *  anon. FTP: quartz.rutgers.edu (/pub/journals)
                     *  or UWI's FTP: 141.214.4.135 (/docs/zines/sound)  
(Imagery is reality) *  Also through EMAIL and soon through GOPHER 

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In article <1992Sep21.052828.16823@noose.ecn.purdue.edu> xxxx@peptide.ecn.purdue.edu (Name Redacted) writes:

   The definition I found for 'boneless' is:
 1. A light beige color    OR
 2. A ghost like spirit of the night.

   In response to a previous note:
   I finally decided that the 'unknown character' at the drug-sale at the
   end of episode 3 was either 'Bernard Renault' or the 'Grim Reaper' character.

If you mean the hooded figure who appeared before Major Briggs
vanished, Briggs referred to him as ``a guardian''.

   Leo killed Bernard in episode 4 or 5.  If it was Bernard, his character is
   dead in the series and we cannot ever know for sure.  

How about the character with Leo being Sheriff Cable, from Deer
Meadows?  Lil's dance indicated he was involved with drugs; and deputy
Cliff was the mule who delivered the goods to Bobby and Laura.  Mind
you, I don't have any strong evidence for this, but I bring it up as a
possibility.

-30-
Bob

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In article <1992Sep21.124415.638@scott.skidmore.edu> mfrazer@scott.skidmore.edu (matthew frazer) writes:

   Ya know, mebbe Major Briggs is judy in the lodge.
   (OK I Doubt it too, but then who is Judy)

Judy in Disguise?  (With glasses?)

-30-
Bob

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In article <1992Sep22.164845.20514@syma.sussex.ac.uk> grahamt@syma.sussex.ac.uk (Graham Thomas) writes:

   I know this is a bit off the subject, but I couldn't resist.

   Last weekend the film Barbarella was shown on British TV.  My local
   paper, the Brighton Evening Argus, claimed that Roger Vadim wants to
   remake the film with Sherilyn Fenn in the title role.

   Can this be true?

I heard the same rumor over Labor Day weekend (in Chicago), so at
least it's spread around.

      The mind, as they say, boggles.

Hey, Sherilyn Fenn is not an intellectual carrot!

       I wonder how Lynch
   might direct this one, given the chance?

Is it Lynch's style?  The whole Pygar the angel's ``an angel has no
memory'' allows for a character to be physically preserved without
being redeemed in some way or another.  Which doesn't seem to match
Lynch's interests.

-30-
Bob


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In article <BuuJC3.LGK@world.std.com> fuzzbox@world.std.com (Every Man and Woman is a Star) writes:
   v075q5fr@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Scott J Gorcey) writes:

   >     Robert Iger hated ON THE AIR.  The 6 episodes produced were
   >     it, actually.  It was supposed to be a mid-season replacement,
   >     but ABC "cancelled" it before it was ever broadcast.

   so, how many episodes *were* broadcast??? Here, in Boston, only 2 were 
   shown. I've heard that there was a third one broadcast, but have never
   seen it or heard from anybody who has a copy of it. 

The third episode was pre-empted in the Boston area for some sporting
event or beauty pagent or some such.  (I believe the ABC NH affiliate
did show it at the regular time.)  Unlike Twin Peaks, which would be
shown after midnight in such circumstances, the Boston ABC affiliate
just let it fall through the cracks.  ABC then replaced _On the Air_
with another series.

-30-
Bob

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In article <1992Sep19.182524.20360@exu.ericsson.se> exurobv@exu.ericsson.se writes:
> >In article J8v@news.cso.uiuc.edu, ash50842@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Dres) writes:
>> >> 
>> >>    Maybe it's just me, but has anyone noticed yet how odd it is that the
>> >> Trailer Park guy says that many people have been visiting Teresa's place?
>> >> I mean, Teresa had no family, no friends, and so not many people would care
>> >> just to see where she used to live.  And I'm sure the cops didn't spend too
>> >> much time looking for clues in there, if they went in there at all.
>> >>    So what's the deal?  Who are the visitors?
>> >> see the trailer.  But why did she come in?  What was the whole point of that
>> >> sequence?
> >
> >I think that is an interesting point about the visitors. I also noticed that in
> >the movie, but had just assumed that it had been traffic from the Deer Meadow
> >cops (although with the Deputy living in the trailer park, you would think
> >that they wouldn't have had to mess with the park manager much).

Two tidbits... I'd have to see the film again to be certain (only 3 times -
hey, what a memory, eh?), but didn't Harry Dean Stanton's character (the
trailer park manager) mention visitors to Teresa's trailer while she was
alive?  (As opposed to strictly after and in reaction to her death.)  If so,
well... she was turning tricks, and though we know she took some of them
to motels, frequent short visits is one of the tell-tale signs of
both prostitution and drug-dealing.  If they were only talking about the
period of time after her death, then ignore this comment!

However, even if they were only referring to visits that occurred after
her death, Stanton's character was *wonderfully* committed to doing
nothing.  From his "not before 9am" message scrawled on the door, to
the many, many notes tacked to that same door (that you just *know*
haven't been dealt with), to the woman who accosts him wanting her
hot water fixed, to Stanton's line about "just more stuff I gotta do"...
this is one guy who *really* doesn't want to deal with life
maintenance chores, or reality in general!  One of my favorite little
moments in the film is when he tells Chester and Sam that he hasn't
"touched a god damn thing!" in Teresa's trailer... *boy* do I believe
him!!  Anyway, to such a person, I suspect that even *one* visitor -
one more thing he's gotta do - would make him remember and comment
on the traffic to her trailer.
-- -larryy@apple.com "Shi Nou Kou Sho Inu Neko Programmer" - Takada Naoki

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In article <1992Sep22.214406.28140@neptune.inf.ethz.ch> rmichl@iiic.ethz.ch (Robert Michl) writes:
> > 
> >Sad but true: There won't be any more new Twin Peaks films :-(
> >This is a text I found in a movie-magazin (cinema [europe], 8/92).
> >It's a guest comment David Lynch wrote. 
> >I tried to translate it:
> > 
> > D A V I D   L Y N C H - Gastkommentar
> > -------------------------------------
> > 
> >Auf dem Festival von Cannes wurde mir   % At the festival in Cannes I was asked
> >immer wieder dieselbe Frage gestellt:% the same question over and over 
> >'Warum haben Sie "Twin Peaks - Fire Walk% again: 'Why did you shoot "Twin Peaks
> >With Me" gedreht?' Ist das nicht bloss  % Fire Walk With Me"?' Isn't that just 
> >ein Aufguss der Fernsehserie? Ein Plagi-% a rehash of the tv series? A plagia-
> >at in eigener Sache? Darauf moechte ich % rism on one's own account? I'd like 
> >zweierlei erwidern: Zunaechst einmal ist% to answer in two ways: First of all  
> >der Film mein Kirschkuchen-Geschenk fuer% is the movie my cherrypie-present for
> >die Fans der Serie - allerdings eines,  % the fans of the series - but one that
> >das in Stacheldraht verpackt ist. Zum   % is wrapped in barbed wire. On the  
> >anderen sind mir die Figuren der Serie  % other hand, the characters of the se-
> >einfach ans Herz gewachsen. Ich hatte   % ries are very dear to me. I wanted to
> >Lust, noch einmal symbolisch von ihnen  % say symbolically goodbye to them once
> >Abschied zu nehmen. Mir wurde instinktiv% more. Instinctively I realised that
> >klar, dass die Geschichte von Laura Pal-% the story of Laura Palmer wasn't told
> >mer noch nicht restlos zu Ende erzaehlt % to the end entirely. As a corpse 
> >war. Als Wasserleiche gab sie der Serie % found in water, she gave the series
> >ihren inneren Antrieb. Ich wollte sie   % it's inner drive. I wanted to reani-
> >noch einmal zum Leben erwecken, sie     % mate her once again, hear her tal-
> >sprechen hoeren, sich bewegen sehen.    % king, watch her moving. But to pre-
> >Aber um allen Irrtuemern vorzubeugen: Es% vent all errors: There won't be no
> >wird keine weiteren "Twin Peaks"-Folgen % more "Twin Peaks" - episodes, this 
> >geben, dies ist das Ende.               % is the end.
> >                                       :-(
> >                                        %  

 He says no more episodes but that doesn't mean no more movies (either released
 in the theatres or video. Didn't someone already post when they viewed the
 premiere of the movie with Robert Engels present that he said afterwards
 that he and Lynch would be making a sequel to the movie within 1-2 years?
 I mean, there NEEDS to be a sequel.. they introduced a lot of new things
 that need resolving as well as older stuff. I mean even Lynch in the movie
 as Gordon Cole tries to make 2 things stick out that need answering in a
 sequel such as Coop: Phillip Jeffries - he was here. 
Cole: The question is, where is he now? And what happened to
      Agent Desmond?

      It would be sad if Lynch doesn't finish what he started.

 -=*George*=-      




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